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 Replies: 14 / Views: 1,785 |
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New Member
38 Posts |
hello everyone. I'm relatively new to collecting but I would like to ask everyone a question that we newbies are wondering about.
ive found proof coins in circulation as I'm sure a lot of you have but unless there is an S mint mark on a coin everyone in the coin community has the same opinion......Not a proof. its either been harshly cleaned or has had too much wear to say definitely that a coin was struck in SF using A proof die and planchet without the S mint mark.
I realize that at some point a proof coin will be unrecognizable do to wear but I have seen some strange things lately that bring into question what I thought about how coins were seen by everyone.
my question i:
Is honesty being thrown out the window in order to protect ones reputation?
I have a worn 45 year old dime. it has a 1/8 wide strip strike through (of something ) completely through the reverse. the rim is wore quite a bit. the reeds are pretty flattened out but still have good depth and complete separation from each other. of course there are nicks, dings, scratches ect... devices are not well defined as you would expect a proof coin to be either. However it is exactly what you would expect to see in a 45 year old circulated proof dime.
but everything can be clearly seen on both sides. Aren't there supposed to be experts, people who can tell that a coin has this or that attribute and say for certain whether a coin has a proof strike or a business strike appearance after being in circulation. such as metal flow lines or if it is still completely mirrored on both sides. can't the experts determine if a coins surface has been intentionally altered, cleaned/polished? or that the missing metal is consistent with normal circulation wear?
I used only mild soap and water and gently removed the layers of buildup. it took about 3 months removing a little at a time being careful not to remove any more surface metal. now I'm told by a few veterans that my dime is too shiny to be a proof.
I know you are all going to say "DONT CLEAN YOUR COINS". if I hadnt I never would have caught it. the edge was very strange for a circulated dime. who is smart enough to know the things ive mentioned above?
please let me know . I'm not stubborn. if reality is that this dime is too far gone then ill give up. finding an expert that doesn't care what others thin about him would be a God send. it is what it is. thank you my friends .
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Moderator
 United States
187934 Posts |
Is A Proof Coin Really Always A Proof Coin?
Yes.
Proof is how the coin is made. It is not its condition.
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Moderator
United States
56855 Posts |
 to CCF. Not all proof coins have an S mint mark. A proof coin is totally different than a business strike coin,different dies and different planchets. Proof is not a condition,it is a minting process. John1  |
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Moderator
United States
187934 Posts |
Davere, I edited your post to break it into paragraphs. This makes it easier to digest. It also made it clear to me that your question needs a more complete answer than the one I gave above.  |
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New Member
 38 Posts |
ive been studying proofs for 4 months solid. ive read and seen a lot of examples of both types of dimes. proof strikes and business strikes. I have 100s of hours of study so far. Education in grading is what I think I need now. either that or in the politics of coin collecting.
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Is a proof always a proof, yes Can a proof always be identified as one, no Quote:
Is honesty being thrown out the window in order to protect ones reputation? I don't really under stand this question Quote:
Aren't there supposed to be experts, people who can tell that a coin has this or that attribute and say for certain whether a coin has a proof strike or a business strike appearance after being in circulation. such as metal flow lines or if it is still completely mirrored on both sides. Depends how worn something is. Many of those attributes you described and more disappear after to much wear. Quote:
can't the experts determine if a coins surface has been intentionally altered, cleaned/polished? yes Quote:
or that the missing metal is consistent with normal circulation wear? for the most part yes |
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New Member
38 Posts |
thanks for the reminder. I understand condition is a factor if say a train ran it over. you know and I know a proof is a proof but grading companies duck these no S coins if they have been circulated. and so do dealers. show me an impaired proof no S dime in a slab. they say that they are too rare to exist in circulation. my dime has no grey color or metal flow lines at all and thats just one bell. it has whistles too. A business struck dime with any wear at all or even MS 69 will not be completely mirrored on both sides. unless its been altered or faked. I could have a fake. its just as likely that it is a fake as it being real. ive sent photos to ANACS and NGC and they both refused to accept it. they refuse to even look at it. that tells me to save my money. and forget about PCGS.. can I send it to the US mint to authenticate it? I dont need it graded. if the mint says its a proof struck dime ive got a chance. thanks again guys and gals.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
589 Posts |
While it is possible that a grading company could identify a heavily worn coin as a proof (aside from issues that were ONLY struck as proofs), as it is a specific minting process, and should be able to differentiate it from a business strike...it's possible, I would say. But, even it were possible, is it really worth it? Does it really matter? A proof dime from 1975 (2020-45) would be worth... Wait...are we talking about a possible 1975 No-S Roosevelt dime? Okay...I can see how that could be worth the expense of grading. But, I'll say it right now: there's a nigh 100% chance your coin is a business strike. And not a No-S Proof. Don't get your hopes up anymore than they already are. If it's too good to be true, it probably is. And there are only two known examples. If you really want to know if yours is legitimate, there's only one way to do it: send it in for grading. Let the experts, with a guarantee to attribution/grade tell you what it is. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
589 Posts |
Quote:
if the mint says its a proof struck dime ive got a chance I don't think the US Mint is going to tell you if it's a proof, so much as they'll just verify that it's authentic. That is, of course, if you can convince the US Mint to do that for a dime. |
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:
A business struck dime with any wear at all or even MS 69 will not be completely mirrored on both sides. unless its been altered or faked. A PL coin would be in MS grades even though it isn't a proof. Quote:
ive sent photos to ANACS and NGC and they both refused to accept it. Unless it is 100 percent way off what you're saying the response was probably that you have to send it in for an opinion. They aren't in the business of grading things from pictures for free. If they told you not to waste your money than it is probably no where close to what you're hoping Quote:
If you really want to know if yours is legitimate, there's only one way to do it: send it in for grading. Let the experts, with a guarantee to attribution/grade tell you what it is. This |
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New Member
38 Posts |
thanks Groszy. I will send it in at some point. there is a lot going for it. I dropped it a few times but thats trivial . its not like I'm trying to hide its impairments . one shop owner did agree that is was a proof and I think thats whats keeping in this game. anyway please read my comment above yours in case you missed it. thank you. I need any and all suggestions on where to go from here. I will give up when the graders leave me no choice. thats where its going to end. I'm just trying to improve my chances at this point.
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New Member
38 Posts |
pictures wont help, well not from a phone anyway. I'm having trouble finding a clear edge photo of a 70s era proof dimes. the ones in the coin shops are in sets. if someone knows of photos I would appreciate it. [ have only one photo and it also looks exactly like mine. also there is a 2011 CoinWorld article that mentions that one of the known examples of the 75 PR has details not consistent a proof strike and a rough area around the torch. my coin has a extremely rough 1/8 strip across the entire reverse. the strip cuts right through torch. it looks like a strike through or maybe an oily area before strike. jf anyone knows more about this that might help. also any info on the SF mint employees assayers' intentionally making proof errors in the 70s would be helpful. the two known examples of the 75 didnt have planchet errors but mine certainly does. thanks |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7008 Posts |
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New Member
38 Posts |
i posted several pic. in the grading section under "For Grading And Condition Opinions. 1975 Roosevelt dime" if anyone would like to see it. |
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New Member
United States
3 Posts |
As people mentioned technically they certainly should be but I would be lying if I wasn't a little bit suspicious at times another thing I have issue with is the criteria that goes into designating some thing is proof like yes that and essentially just polished I don't know 🤷 #127995;#8205;#9794;#65039;
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Replies: 14 / Views: 1,785 |
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Posted 02/05/2020 3:23 pm
