Mexico 1792 8 Reales Fake

I can see why someone would be fooled by those 1792 fakes but have no idea why anyone would pay for that replica coin. I've seen others like it on ebay recently.

threefifty I hope you posted this example as what is wrong with the TPG's and what should be avoided on ebay.

MS 63 for a coin with corrosion? It is also a very poor strike, with actual high point wear and a serious bump in the hairlines.

I view the coin as possibly a Numismatic Forgery because of the presence of very odd raised features.



The features in the ovals are post strike damage that should preclude a grade of MS 63 and the rectangles contain curved features that look like threads or hairs on the surface of the coin that were copied by a transfer process to forged dies.

A great example of why trust in TPG's is actually misplaced.

threefifty The color change you illustrate may be a metal change - however, it is so large that even a TPG should have spotted it.

I saw it and didn't bother with it because of the corrosion that is clearly visible on the obverse and reverse opposite one another. That made me less than certain that it was a metallic change. You see there are sulfur oxides of silver that turn silver this same brownish color before it darkens to the more common black tarnish. Water and air are needed to cause the change in color.

In photographs it is notoriously difficult to be of exactly what you are looking at. In hand you can look for the transition line microscopically to see if the coin is a Sheffield plate (or some other form of silver plate) versus oxidation. They all look completely different when magnified.

Even before my concerns about this being an encapsulated counterfeit, I was more concerned that NGC had violated their own rules by encapsulating a damaged coin. There is Damage in a high interest area - the Portrait - and worse still there is obvious corrosion - Environmental damage. Even if this thing was genuine it NEVER SHOULD HAVE ESCAPED A BODY BAG.

Want to bet it was submitted by a powerful dealer or auction house? When NGC deals with small guys who order few encapsulations, they rely on any excuse to return a coin in a body bag - however when a large consignor makes the same submission they always get a GRADE.

When are collector and investors going to catch onto the scam that TPG grading has become?

I could do far better personally and for far less money as I am sure that many people on this forum could for their own specialties - but who knows Swamperbob or Realeswatcher or anyone else who is really an expert?

Thanks, swamperbob, for the thorough reply. I'll take a harder look in the future before relying on photographs to show things like metal changes. Very intriguing points about the grading - I'm too much of a novice to add anything there but I will continue to read with interest.