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Is This A Violation Of Any Ebay Rules?

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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2022  8:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wrekkdd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@SAP, thanks. I guess a loophole would be to post a rare mule as the photo and then purchase the first coin out of the 4 that are available. Then say the first one was that exact coin. So if 4/4 were available and I purchased all 4 then one of them would have to be the rare coin. then the seller couldn't say the first coin they sold/bought was the coin in the photo.

Ill keep an eye out for similar listings when I'm on ebay.
Edited by Wrekkdd
01/19/2022 8:11 pm
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hfjacinto's Avatar
United States
7276 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2022  8:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hfjacinto to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wouldn't it be a moral violation to purchase an $100 coin for $1 (when you know its a $100 coin)?
Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2022  8:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wrekkdd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Wouldn't it be a moral violation to purchase an $100 coin for $1 (when you know its a $100 coin)?


Some would argue no. The first thing I did when I saw the listing was message the seller saying that the coin in the photo was worth much more then the listing price even if only 1/4 was that coin. I posted here about it afterwards. I myself didn't but any of the last 3 of 4 that were available. If one of the 4 did turn out to be the true mule then I feel worse for the seller then the buyer but that's not the case most of the time.

I guess cherry picking or any business goes against the idea of morals of getting a steal of a deal by knowing what you know. I'm not into profiting off this hobby. It's my hobby not my job, it brings Me joy and knowledge and something to leave behind in the late late future to my family and as teach my son about.
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silviosi's Avatar
Canada
6244 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2022  9:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add silviosi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@jacinto: What is moral and not? Immoral it is an advertising wrong. So hide the true from prospectus buyers. In this case it is or lack of knowledge about or simply want to sel.

Next week I will put many FDC on stamps with more then 50% under real price. I am immoral or just I want to give away those FDC? You can not know. I put 200$ coin for 100$. Do you think I do not know?, you are wrong. Was my decision and I do not advertise wrong. Immoral is advertising wrong like in Etsy and also some on E-Bay.
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hfjacinto's Avatar
United States
7276 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2022  9:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add hfjacinto to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I like how the shoe fits.

If a dealer sells a $1 coin for $100 it's illegal and he should be banned.

But if a seller can buy a $100 coin for $1 it's cherry picking.

Please keep the outrage to yourself, it's so hypocritical.
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silviosi's Avatar
Canada
6244 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2022  10:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add silviosi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Please come buy my FDC 5$ with 1$ next week. Hypocritical for you but this I want. If it is illegal please show me the law, and I will obey. Your thinking rules do not mean apply in the real life. Please do not go by your own frustrations because something is sell behind your prices and you are afraid loose business. This it is greedy thinking, not place here.

If you say I am Hypocritical, OK I will send you a message and put an CC gold for 500$, I will let you know first, maybe you will be happy.
Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2022  07:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wrekkdd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I can imagine an in person deal is much different then ebay. If I went into my LCS and the owner offered me an amazing deal, say a mint state large bust 73 for 50$. I would jump on it because there is absolutely no way they would not know the true value, I would be very grateful. If I went into the same store and purchased a coin worth 50$ for 200$ that would be on me.

Now talking about ebay, if a seller advertises a rare coin for sale and there is only one in a lot of 4 coins(doubtful all 4 would be the rare coin if any) if the dealer says 1/4 sold right from the start they can now sell 3 over priced basic coins(not extremely over priced, in this case 2$) this would be immoral and simply false advertising, which is immoral and illegal. Now of one of the 4 actually was the rare coin I would notify the seller and offer a better price if they wanted,even after already paying for and receiving the coins.

All this said I believe in this scenario the seller knew what they were doing and did not intend to sell the rare coin for 2$, they simply used it as a way to lure potential buyers. There is no way to know for sure unless all 4 were for sale originally and you purchased All 4. This wasn't a question about ones morals as one can differ then another. This was simply a question as to weather or not what the seller was doing was breaking ebay policies.
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Canada
5589 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2022  08:21 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add okiecoiner to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I really don't understand what all the hubbub is all about. I don't think that the seller knew what the photo said that he had. He very well could have a diary of coin photos, just to show as "examples". I personally don't think that he even had 4 of that date nickel. He had a stock photo that he could post to show something similar to what he had. At coin shows in the local T.O. area, I am always looking for Vicky large cent varieties. There is not a show goes by that I don't tell a dealer, or 2 or 3, that he has a scarce coin mismarked as a normal one and that he should reprice it. They thank me greatly and the next show that comes around, they sometimes have a great deal for me. Honesty pays. I don't think that the vendor knew that the photo was anything more than a well-worn nickel and this thread has gone on now for 2 pages.
Edited by okiecoiner
01/20/2022 08:24 am
Pillar of the Community
Canada
5324 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2022  08:25 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add john100 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Simply sometimes some collectors take a five buck flyer on such items, it would cost more to return than the effort, even the seller has a tough time making much from these types of sale
Pillar of the Community
Canada
632 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2022  09:21 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add t_y to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just wondering: how much someone's investment and time to gain knowledge worth?

It is the knowledge that 'creates' the variety therefore the interest and the consequent intrinsic value of a collectable.

I put many hours of research to identify twoonie varieties, most of them frequently discussed here. Today I easily pick them up still unassigned - is this un-ethical or a reward for my contribution to Numismatics?
Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2022  09:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wrekkdd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The description stated that the coin in the photo was one of the four for sale. If a stock photo of a rare variety or mule was used for selling regular non rare version I would say it goes against ebay policies. That's all this thread was about and somehow turned into a conversation about morals. My question was simple and has been answered at this point. Posting a photo of a rare coin saying it is included in a lot of several coins when it is not goes against ebay policies. If the seller didn't know the photo was a rare variety, then he was notified by me before the sale finished. If he didn't actually have that same coin for sale then it's against ebay policies.
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SPP-Ottawa's Avatar
Canada
10458 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2022  09:54 am  Show Profile   Check SPP-Ottawa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add SPP-Ottawa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I once bought a Vicky large cent, corroded, from a dealer's junk bin for $2 at Nuphilex. It was a G-4 1881H SIngle Serif N.

The next morning I went to that same dealer, who said he was an "expert" on varieties. So I asked him, if he had an 1881H SSN in his inventory. He said, "Beh non, never seen one". So I showed him mine, and after studying everything on it, he insisted on buying it. He asked if I found it at the show, and I pointed to his junk bin. He then thanked me for teaching him something new, and handed me $200 for the coin.

The ironic part, is this guy now sees me come to his table, and he now scrutinizes EVERYTHING I select, just in case he missed something. So I sometimes buy a vanilla 1918 large cent, watch him scratch his head over the coin for several minutes, and wink at him when I pay for it.

Most times if it is not specifically something I am looking for, I tell the dealer they missed something. They appreciate the lesson and usually keep me in mind when they find errors. The only cherries I tend to pick are new discoveries, which is fair game, until it is published.
"Discovery follows discovery, each both raising and answering questions, each ending a long search, and each providing the new instruments for a new search." -- J. Robert Oppenheimer

Content of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_US

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SPP-Ottawa's Avatar
Canada
10458 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2022  09:57 am  Show Profile   Check SPP-Ottawa's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add SPP-Ottawa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It is far more rewarding cherry-picking cherry pickers.

And, I have been cherry picked, with a coin I just plain forgot about (but happy it now has a good home).

Those are stories for another time.
"Discovery follows discovery, each both raising and answering questions, each ending a long search, and each providing the new instruments for a new search." -- J. Robert Oppenheimer

Content of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_US

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papeldog's Avatar
Canada
1923 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2022  10:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add papeldog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sometimes the hard knocks in life are the better lessons a person never forgets them.
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1352 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2022  1:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bosox to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For several years now, since I started publishing books, anything I want to buy face-to-face at a coin show gets scrutinized. The dealers are worried that I am cherry picking some truly rare variety that they do not know about. In fact, usually the opposite occurs, and I tell them what they have. In the one I remember from my last coin show (when the heck was that?), after looking through a box of 2x2s, I showed a prominent dealer where he had marked an 1859 DP1 as a vanilla N9, about a $400 price difference.

I think there is fine line between repeatedly being successful at cherry picking and getting a rep for ripping people off. (Remember the dealer who bought a roll of circulated 1925 five-cent pieces for peanuts?) Rep in the Canada coin market is important to me. I want to trust those with whom I am dealing, and I want them to trust me. If that costs me some extra dollars, so be it.

As to the OP, these days I usually assume the worst about E-Bay listings. IMHO it has become saturated with grifters and people who want to unload problem coins. There are some good, honest sellers there, but with so many bad ones, it is hard to sort them out.
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2011 & 2025 Fred Bowman Award Winner, 2020 J. Douglas Ferguson Award Winner, & 2022 Paul Fiocca Award Winner. Life Member of RCNA.
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