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How Far Back Can We Go? Seventh Edition! Ended At 1380 Waiting On 1379

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bd251's Avatar
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 Posted 11/16/2023  12:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bd251 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Crimean Khanate Islam Giray II akce, AH 992
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

https://www.zeno.ru/showgallery.php?cat=2184
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1c5d7n5m's Avatar
Belgium
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 Posted 11/16/2023  12:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 1c5d7n5m to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
thanks erafjel (you were posting while I was writing my post)

the franc you show today is a great piece
just amazing how much the fashion of France and England coincided, just compare the Leicester portraits of 1586 and 1587 with Henri in 1584
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1c5d7n5m's Avatar
Belgium
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 Posted 11/16/2023  1:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 1c5d7n5m to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@tdziemia, to come back to Stefan Bathory:


Quote:
I get the impression he was not terribly vain


I read an interesting paper about him; published in a medical journal: Nephrol Dial Transplant (1998) 13: 2690-2696, the bottom line being that king Stefan Bathory was the first patient ever diagnosed with polycystic kidney disease. This chronic disease which can be complicated by severe gout, may have influenced his appearance.
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erafjel's Avatar
Sweden
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 Posted 11/16/2023  1:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add erafjel to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
just amazing how much the fashion of France and England coincided, just compare the Leicester portraits of 1586 and 1587 with Henri in 1584

Indeed - my guess is that English nobility glanced over the Channel to see what was hot in Paris, and Henri and his noblemen and -women in turn looked at what was fashionable in Spain and Italy. Where Philip II of Spain etc got his inspiration from, I don't know .
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 Posted 11/16/2023  4:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
amazing how much the fashion of France and England coincided,


This was also a bit related to my comment on Stefan Bathory. He never adopts that ruffed (Spanish) collar that is the fashion in the rest of Europe. And the comment on kidney disease is really interesting.
1584 was the first year of operation of the Malbork mint, so here is a solidus/shilling stuck there:
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

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Belgium
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 Posted 11/17/2023  05:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 1c5d7n5m to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
1583

The low countries were divided in three parts at this stage of the war:
1) the Northern provinces who had united by the Union of Utrecht (1579) and who had abdicated from king Philip
2) the most Southern provinces (Arras, Hainaut, Namur) who in reaction to the above had united by the Union of Atrecht (1579)
3) the "in-between" provinces of Brabant, Flanders, Ghelders where political chaos (instability, different leaders) was prominent.

The pieces of today all related to third region and illustrate the instability, in particular related to the presence of the governor, François-Hercule de Valois-Angoulême, duc d'Alençon, duke of Anjou (1555-1584), youngest son of Catherine de' Medici and Henri II of France and the younger brother of king Henri III of France.

The first piece is a half Daalder minted with the portrait of François d'Alençon called Anjou from now on. These half daalders were minted in Antwerp and Bruges only in small quantities and these are rare today. The obverse shows the coat of arms of Anjou and his (not very modest) adage AETERNUM. MEDITANS. DECUS (aspiring to eternal glory). The reverse shows a very sharp hand (mintmark of Antwerp), a weak portrait and the legend FRN · F · FRAAN · FRAN · VNIC · REG · D·G · DUX · BRA (François de France , Only King?, by the grace of God, Duke of Brabant). Anjou was a tragicomic figure who experienced failure after failure in his short life. The idea of a wedding with queen Elizabeth I of England did not work out (the queen refused); his leadership in Flanders was a disaster, starting with a treacherous attack on Antwerp. Shortly after his brief lordship in Flanders he died in France from tuberculosis.

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

The three jetons below also allude to the presence of Anjou in Brabant & Flanders. The first is from Bruges, memorising the failed attempt of Anjou to take the city of Antwerp by military force.

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

Dugn.2932var Bruges 'Failure of the attack of Anjou on Antwerp'.
OBV: Shepherd protects his sheep against a wolf BON PASTOR PONIT ANIMAM PRO OVIB SVIS
REV: Farmer sowinf VT SEMINA VERIS METES GAND 1583
mintmarks: lion OBV & REV lilly REV

The second is typical for the propaganda-type jetons of Holland. Anjou is depicted as a puppet executing the plan of Philippe II of Spain.

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

Dugn.2939 Dordrecht 'People of Ghent turn away from Anjou'
OBV: Virgin (Flanders) is chained at the feet by the duke of Anjou king Philips II is watching ; the Flanders lion is roaring
legend VBI REX IN POPVLVM TIRANNVS 1583
REV Virgin (Flanders), free from the chains, carries hat of liberty and takes wedding ring from Ajou; the lion is at peace POPVLO IV..RE D ET H DIVORTIVM

Ghent had chosen the more radical direction, away from Anjou who could not be trusted. Instead of accepting the more moderate course advocated by William of Orange (who supported religious freedom) Ghent turned to radical calvinism under leadership of Jan van Hembyse (1517-1584). The revolting people of Ghent discovered however that Hembyse negociated in secrecy with Alexander Farnese (who laid siege to the city). So on 23 march 1584 Hembyse was beheaded in the city on charge of treason.

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

Dugn.2942 'Return of exiled Jan van Hembyse to Ghent'
OBV Virgin & lion - coat of arms Flanders, on the flag SPQG (senatus populusque Gandavensis).
legend BEATVS POPVLVS CVIVS IOVA DEVS EST 1583 (blessed the people whose god is Jehova).
REV above: SILLY, SILLY (battle cry of the family) and SOBRIE VIGILANLANTER (modest and vigilant) - below: coat of arms HEMBYZE

telling the story of unfortunate Hembyse, who doublecrossed his city and its radical religious cause, SILLY, SILLY gets a different meaning than a battle cry.







Edited by 1c5d7n5m
11/17/2023 06:05 am
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Sweden
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 Posted 11/17/2023  10:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add erafjel to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
the legend FRN · F · FRAAN · FRAN · VNIC · REG · D·G · DUX · BRA (François de France , Only King?, by the grace of God, Duke of Brabant).

It is FRA VNIC + if we assume that FRAAN is a slightly misspelled FRAN, then, according to Rentzmann's Numismatisches Legenden-Lexicon, it means Franciscus Filius Franciae Frater Unicus Regis Dei Gratia Dux Brabantiae = Francis, Son of France, Single Brother of the King, By Grace of God Duke of Brabant.

Quote:
The idea of a wedding with queen Elizabeth I of England did not work out (the queen refused)

She also turned down a proposal from Erik XIV, king of Sweden 1560-1568. Popular but determined girl.

And as usual, very interesting jetons.
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Belgium
1185 Posts
 Posted 11/17/2023  11:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 1c5d7n5m to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks erafjel
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 Posted 11/17/2023  10:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here is a Groschen from the German Duchy of Julian-Kleve-Berg:

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
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tdziemia's Avatar
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 Posted 11/18/2023  06:10 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I will sneak in this 1583 trojak struck in Olkusz:
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379
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Belgium
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 Posted 11/18/2023  07:37 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 1c5d7n5m to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
1582

François Alençon, the duke of Anjou, who was discussed already yesterday, was officially in charge of the leadership of the rebelling provinces against Spain. A major reason for the need of a sovereign leader was acte van verlatinghe (declaration of independence from Spain) which was signed in 1581. William of Orange could have filled this position, but he was too much inclined to calvinism, so the States General preferred Anjou who was a catholic prince and the brother of the king of France. During the first months of his reign, Anjou was received with optimism as is clear from the two following jetons:

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

Dugn.2873 Bruges 'Inauguration of the duke of Anjou in Flanders'
OBV portrait of Anjou FRAN F FRAN FRA UNIC REG D G COM FL. (Franciscus Filius Franciae Frater Unicus Regis Dei Gratia Comes Flandriae)
KZ Coat of arms Flanders DOMINVS MICHI ADIVTOR (the adage of Philip II, which is remarkable given this moment in the rebellion)

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

Dugn.2867 'Trust in the good governance of the duke of Anjou'
OBV: Providence and Temperance around a pile of arms that is kept in very delicate (unstable) balance TEMPERANDO ET PROVIDENDO
REV: Woman helps man BELGIA RENASCERE (the rebirth of Begium) 1582

Doubts arose soon about the reliabilty of Anjou to defend the cause of the rebels. This situation was not ameliorated by the first attempt to assassinate Orange in Delft. Phillippe had put a price on the head of Orange and Juan de Jáuregui attempted to shoot the prince from short range on March 18, 1582. The pistol malfunctioned however, so the prince got only wounded in the face and recovered after some weeks good care of his wife.

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

Dugn.2890 Dordrecht 'Failed attack on the life of William of Orange'
Vz. Juan de Jáuregui shoots at the head of Orange PRODITIONE NON ARMIS AGITVR
Kz. Hail and thunder over Philippe II and two aides PRODITOR TANDEM LVET 1582

The last jeton of today illustrates the conditions in Hainaut (territory already reconquered from the rebels by Alexander Farnese).

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

Dugn.2856 Bruges 'Deplorable situation in Hainaut'
VZ Allegoric woman representing the province of Hainaut, laying down, sick and poor REBVS AFFLICTIS - HANNONIA 1582
KZ Coat of arms of Sint-Waudru of Mons COMPTES ET GETTES IVSTEMENT
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 Posted 11/18/2023  4:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Fascinating!

Here is a somewhat unusually large (for my collection anyway) silver coin: 1 Franc from Navarre-Bearn, France. Even with a clipped rim, it is 32 mm in diameter and 13.7 g.

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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tdziemia's Avatar
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 Posted 11/19/2023  12:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wonderful continuing history lesson. It almost looks like the figure of Philip II under the hail was copied from the 1577 Estates General issues where he is shown with crown and scepter (I really should have one of these in my Brabant collection, but not yet).

I am still in Poland-Lithuania, with a 1582 schilling/solidus struck at the Gdansk mint:
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379
How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

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Belgium
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 Posted 11/19/2023  6:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 1c5d7n5m to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
It almost looks like the figure of Philip II under the hail was copied from the 1577 Estates General issues where he is shown with crown and scepter


great comment - you mention the Statendaalder / Ecu des Etats indeed for the posture of the king, there is a resemblance in style

on the other hand Holland did not issue Statendaalders; we'll see in the year 1575 that Holland chose for a very revolutionary monetary course
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 Posted 11/19/2023  6:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 1c5d7n5m to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
a few years ago I bought this 1581 Franc 'quatre H' from Henri IV of France, who was also king of Navarre and Bearn

How-Far-Back-Can-We-Go?-Seventh-Edition!-Ended-At-1380-Waiting-On-1379

erafjel explained the importance of the Franc as monetary reform a few days ago

this coin was outside my focus of collection, but I was interested because the design resembles (more than a bit of coincidence - therefore probably influenced by) the half Statendaalder /demi Ecu des Etats, issued 1577-1579 by the revolting states of Flanders, Brabant, Ghelders, Utrecht, Overijssel, Hainaut and Tournai, we'll see examples in a few days.

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