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Anyone Familiar With Malaya 20 Cent Coins From 1943 And 1945?

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Singapore
68 Posts
 Posted 08/03/2025  05:30 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add aster to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I am kinda curious as the 20 cent coins minted 1943 and 1945 are coins with 50% silver content, and the 1943 version has a lower mintage than 1945 version (Is this info correct?)

Excluding the 1945 India minted coin, what is the reason for the 1945 coin to be priced much higher than the 1943 coin?

Edited by aster
08/03/2025 05:37 am
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triggersmob's Avatar
Australia
9354 Posts
 Posted 08/03/2025  07:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add triggersmob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi Aster,

Mintage doesn't always give a true indication of how available a coin is, as can be seen on Numista, by the frequency number. 78% of members own the 1943, but only 27% of members own the 1945. I don't know the reason for this, but maybe the 1945 coins were not all released or were melted down. Maybe someone else has more info.

Anyone-Familiar-With-Malaya-20-Cent-Coins-From-1943-And-1945?
Valued Member
Singapore
68 Posts
 Posted 08/03/2025  09:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add aster to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi triggersmob,

Thanks for the information on mintage.

Yes, I noticed this too on Numista, as well as on NGC world coin price guide. 1943 MS63 vs 1945 MS63 is US$22.50 and US$80 respectively.

But one thing I do notice is the 1945 version usually is being labelled as "key year" by sellers.

Hopefully, someone here with expertise on this can shed some light on this.
Edited by aster
08/03/2025 09:10 am
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Sap's Avatar
Australia
16806 Posts
 Posted 08/03/2025  11:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In 1943, the entire territory of Malaya was under Japanese occupation. Coins were nevertheless produced in 1943 and dated 1943, but were stockpiled in Britain in anticipation of a liberation which unfortunately did not come until the Japanese surrender and peaceful handover at war's end in 1945. The entire stockpile of 1943 coins were then shipped to Malaya and put into circulation, with further coins then minted bearing the 1945 date; the Japanese had withdrawn and melted any pre-occupation silver coins they could find, and issued no coins of their own during the occupation, only now-worthless JIM paper money, so the entire money supply for the territory needed to be renewed and replaced.

Presumably, not all the 1945 coins were actually released to circulation, given the increasing cost of silver. It's worth noting that the silver coins were replaced with cupronickel ones dated 1946. It's likely that sometime in late 1945, after the 10 million coins were struck (but mostly not yet shipped), the decision to replace them with cupronickel coins was made. I'd assume there was some decision that here was no point shipping out the remainder of 1945 if they were just going to be shipped back and melted down again. Or it's possible that they were already shipped, but were obsolete by the time they arrived, so then mostly put back in boxes and shipped back for melting.

You'll notice the liberal use of words like "likely" and "assume" in my post. Sorry I don't have actual facts, but this seems the most probable explanation.

I have one of each coin; a fairly nice (gEF) 1945 20 cents, bought for $7 from a local coin club auction here in Australia in 2011. My 1943 20 cents is in more beat-up condition (a greenish VF) and came in a bulk lot I bought back in 2000.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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tdziemia's Avatar
United States
7933 Posts
 Posted 08/03/2025  4:41 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am always skeptical of numbers for value of coins, unless I know what is behind them.

First, you have to remember that a number posted in a column called "UNC" can reflect the value of coins that are MS61, MS66, any grade between, an average, a median, etc.

There is plenty of data supporting a value near $12 for the 1943 in "UNC." The auction sales of unslabbed coins at the bottom of the listing show sales results at $8, $9, $9, $23 and $30. I can also find 2025 auction results on NGC graded coins between MS61 and MS64 that are in a narrow range between 14 euro and 17 euro.

But I can't find any data whatsoever supporting a value of $83 for the 1945 in UNC, unless it were MS65. In fact, I can find info suggesting the value is no more than half that for lower MS grades.. The October Spink auction had a lot of 6 1945 coins in UNC, half graded 62 and half graded 63. It failed to sell with an estimate of 2200 HKD (about USD 285 as best I can tell). That figures to $47.50 per coin. I don't know Spink's bidding policy, but if it is like most other places, the bidding starts at some fraction of the estimate like 80%, so probably a bid of 1800 HKD ($234 or $39 per coin) could have taken that lot. To me that says the value of coins in these grades averages less than $40.

So, my guess is that a value of $80-something likely reflects a small sample of very high MS grade coins for the 1945, meaning that $12 versus $80 is not "apples-to-apples."
Edited by tdziemia
08/03/2025 4:48 pm
Valued Member
Singapore
68 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2025  09:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add aster to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi all, thank you for your inputs.

Seems like there isn't much further information to go on from here. I watched some Youtube videos, they just repeat the same things but without any further elaborations, like:
"1945 version is highly desirable"
"1945 version has higher premium"
"1945 is the key year"

But here are some data I can find online.

NGC website:
Anyone-Familiar-With-Malaya-20-Cent-Coins-From-1943-And-1945?

Monetarium (Singapore-based auction house):
Anyone-Familiar-With-Malaya-20-Cent-Coins-From-1943-And-1945?

Muse Atlas (Malaysia-based auction house):
Anyone-Familiar-With-Malaya-20-Cent-Coins-From-1943-And-1945?



Edited by aster
08/04/2025 09:54 am
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tdziemia's Avatar
United States
7933 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2025  2:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It shows the market is NOT with European or American auction houses, but is at these two places.

Using an ROE of $0.75 for the Singapore dollar and $0.25 for the RInggit, I get for the MS64 a median price of $95 and $160 for MS65 for the 1945.

SO, maybe $80 is not far off for the MS63, but it wasn't apparent from the lack of sales I caould find.

More data is always a good thing!
Valued Member
Singapore
68 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2025  8:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add aster to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes, probably there is almost no market demand and supply elsewhere other than in Singapore and Malaysia

Meanwhile, for graded pieces lower than MS64 they are generally selling for less than SGD 100
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