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 Replies: 11 / Views: 1,900 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1291 Posts |
Coming from ME, some of you may find this to be an unusual post. For fun, relaxation and a tiny bit of profit I can often be found taking DATELESS Buffalo nickels and chemically restoring them. The nice ones end up on ebay. This is no secret, I've talked about this before on this forum. I am well aware that this makes me a bit of a pariah in the world of coin collectors. "Bottom Feeder" is one of the kinder things I have been called in the pursuit of preserving and resurrecting James Earle Fraser's creation. But earlier this week I took possession of some supposedly dateless nickels from a supplier of mine and I was very disappointed and saddened to find these two coins and a number of others just like them:   Based on my many years of experience restoring oodles of ( now hear this!) DATELESS Buffalo nickels, I can tell you, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that both of these coins had perfectly legible, original dates on them at the time that some knucklehead decided to drip some Nic-a-Date onto them. The 1915-S would have probably been a nice, solid G-4. The Type 1 coin would have been a very decent AG-3. I can only guess that the person who did this did not know that these coins had a lot of appeal just the way they were...either that or they foolishly thought they could improve upon them. Whoever he was, he gives people like me a bad (worse?) name. If you run into this guy, drag him out into the street and slap him a time or two for me! |
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Valued Member
United States
61 Posts |
Quote:
If you run into this guy, drag him out into the street and slap him a time or two for me! Some guy handed me some Jeffersons at work without dates. I assumed this must be the work of the same fellow who did your coins in! I took him outside and taught him a lesson... Unfortunately the cops are less understanding of numismatic redemption. In all seriousness that is really sad. I don't think what you do is terrible. You only restore them until you can see the date, which is understandable. He probably wanted to improve the coin, but as we all know that is just stupid. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2661 Posts |
Would white vinegar take the stain off?
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Moderator
 United States
16677 Posts |
That sucks weerdsteev. I will knock the guy out with my slap :-)
swcoin.ecrater.com
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1291 Posts |
Tim - No, all it would do is continue to attack more of the nickel content in the 2 coins. Vinegar works just like Nic-a-date, only slower. There is nothing that can be done to reverse or mitigate the damage. Even if I go ahead and treat the ENTIRE coin(s) it will most likely turn out badly.
Vinegar, Nic-a-date or the chemical I use all have one thing in common: they work on the part of the coin which is nickel. Worn out, dateless nickels are just more suited for "treatment". The missing date (and other details) on a dateless nickel does NOT magically "rise up" when the chemical is applied, rather, the field around it erodes faster. That's because the field is nickel "rich" and the digits where the date used to be are nickel "poor" (slightly higher copper content from the stamping process) and the chemical is less effective in that area (because it doesn't work on copper).
Treating a dateless nickel makes it look similar to what it looked like back when it had a date and was in fine or very fine condition. Treating a dated nickel just plain ruins it, period.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
The chemical works, not because the area is nickel rich or poor, but because of the slightly different densities of the metal caused by the compression of the dies.
I haven't tried white vinegar but soaking in it might improve the appearance and lessen the stain, but the trade off will be a slightly etched appearance over the entire surface of the coin.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3294 Posts |
I can see how the T1 1913 could be identified without a date, but how on the other?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1291 Posts |
I agree that vinegar or other chemicals applied to the whole coin will even the appearance out somewhat but let's be clear - what has been done to these two coins cannot be called a stain. It's not like grape juice. What you see after using the chemical is the chemical's corrosive effect upon the nickel in the copper-nickel alloy.
Also, I respectfully maintain my original assertion about the nickel and copper distribution. It's not just a guess. A metallurgist did some copper and nickel "mapping" for me on a few dateless nickels and it shows, on average, a greater percent of copper in the area of the digits as compared to the overall coin and a greater percent of nickel in the surrounding field as compared to the overall coin.
It would seem that the compression of the dies forces a higher percentage of the softer copper into the incused areas of the dies.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1291 Posts |
Nod - Toothpick test. The date on a nickel that was truly dateless to begin with will barely resist the point of a toothpick if you slide the toothpick, tip first, up against any part of the date. In the case of these two coins a distinct, hard ridge still exists around portions of the digits, especially on the very tops of the dates and inside the loops of the 3 and the 5. It stops the toothpick tip cold.
Edited by weerdsteev
07/13/2009 4:24 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2589 Posts |
i guess the only way to improve them would be to wear them down as pocket pieces and then nickadate them once the damage has worn away
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2602 Posts |
Can one "unrestore" the date in this case? LOL! Cannot believe someone would ruin a good coin like that.
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Valued Member
United States
321 Posts |
Hate acid dates. Thats not right.... Hmmm I can't say hate... dislike
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Replies: 11 / Views: 1,900 |
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Posted 07/12/2009 07:56 am
