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 Replies: 15 / Views: 2,331 |
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Valued Member
Canada
168 Posts |
If you have an older house and you are not the 1st owners, it time to rip into the walls! Quote:
Man finds treasure above ceiling boards
By JASON HALSTEAD, QMI Agency
WINNIPEG - Fred Murray was hoping for a renovation rebate on the old house he bought, he just didn't think it would come in the form of old coins, shinplasters and other currency from over 100 years ago.
Murray, who runs his own stucco business, bought an Elmwood bungalow last spring and was spurred to renovate by the federal government's Home Renovation Tax Credit.
It was when he ripped out ceiling panels in the 750-square-foot home's basement that he realized he'd be supplementing that funding with some older money.
In addition to Canadian currency -- ranging from regular and commemorative coins to paper money, including the 25-cent bills commonly known as shinplasters to $100-bills -- the collection also included foreign cash from Weimar Germany, 1920s China and the United States, stamps from numerous countries and clippings from Winnipeg newspapers.
"If it pays for the house, it's a bonus," said the 54-year-old.
While Murray said he knew nothing about collectible currency or stamps before his demolition find, he's now a little more up to speed. However, he's not interested enough to hold onto the collection and plans to ship it off this weekend to an Eastern Canada auction house.
He said he has no idea what he'll get for the collection but plans to put it right back into the renovations.
From older neighbours, Murray found out the house was built by a German immigrant named Albert Schmidt -- whose identification he also found in the rafters -- in the 1940s. He lived in the home until sometime in the 1970s.
It was apparently Schmidt who meticulously stashed the collection above ceiling boards between rafters in the basement, Murray said.
"He spent years and years putting this together. I get hold of it and I'm getting rid of it," Murray said.
Murray said coins were packed in cloth bags, pill bottles and tin cans while the bills and stamps were stored in paper envelopes.
Murray said the basement rec-room had been renovated at least three times previously, but in each case new panelling was tacked on over the existing ceiling, leaving the treasure undiscovered.
"That was good for me," he said.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4212 Posts |
Very cool! I bought another 5 br. that has been used as a boardinghouse for about 110 yrs. Since Oct. I've scored a dateable hunk of lint going back to 2007 A.D. and silver ring that's now a nice brown. But what patina! Home ownership has it's advantages!
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1248 Posts |
if you know Fred....
tell him NOT to ship to an auction house.... he will get the proverbial S...w in the back...
IMO, there is NOT a single auction house that is honest when it come to such a find....especially not in a big city..
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2661 Posts |
Well that is the best old house find I have read about in a long time. Thanks for posting that. All I found when I moved to this home I am in now was about 600 red bricks placed randomly over the entire property. In fact after two years and 3 months here I am still finding those things.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2424 Posts |
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Rest in Peace
United States
1729 Posts |
I noticed that some of the boards in my attic were screwed to the joists instead of nailed, so I scanned where I could with my Garret. All I could find was where the knob-and-tube wiring ran. Blah!
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
9164 Posts |
Daughter and son-in law bought a house with detached garage last year and this spring he took the panels off where the garage door should be (just had a man door only) and found ,$11,00 US bills, $205 new 5-10-20 can. , gold bar, Whitman book 67 dimes, whitman book 67 quarters, whitman book 49-50-52-67-68 halves , books all Canadian.
He gave me the Canadian bills and the books for the grand kids albums.
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Valued Member
Australia
138 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1051 Posts |
What if the guy who stashed it all is still alive somewhere? Could he make a claim to it, as his ID was present with the stuff? I'd be inclined to keep my yapper shut if it ever happened to me.
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Valued Member
Canada
351 Posts |
On the contrary, I would be tempted to hunt him down and give it back.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1248 Posts |
wow, since everyone has stories... here is another: It happened in the early 70ties in Manitoba- Canada. a traveling farm equipment salesman in Manitoba befriended a farmers Family. After a few visits in the line of his business the Family offered him to stay there on his sales trips. after two years the farmer told him that he wishes to sell the Farm and perhaps the salesman knew of someone interested. he expressed interest himself, as it was nearly time for him to also retire. They struck a deal which involved an agreement for sale (allows pay out any time), a type of mortgage, being held by the seller. The deal included all furniture and decorations. The farm was sold and the salesman moved in to his new home with his family. a few weeks after a friend came by and became very excited when he saw all the art on the wall and some stashed in the attic. he was an art dealer from Alberta. He recognized one of the paintings in the attic as possibly being a Rembrandt, or as a minimum a painting done by one of Rembrandt's apprentices. The painting was sent to be appraised and sure enough, it was a Rembrandt, a real one.Not a known piece at the time, but ... who cares, it is known now... It was sold in a London Auction for over 800,000 GBP, a lot of money then... oh and also now....! happy salesman....!!  However, the former Farm owner read about it in the press and challenged ownership of the painting, saying it was his, as he simply forgot to take it.... it went to court.....remember, he still is holding a Mortgage on the farm.... any guesses what the outcome was? |
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Moderator
 United States
6563 Posts |
Quote:
What if the guy who stashed it all is still alive somewhere? Could he make a claim to it, as his ID was present with the stuff? All contents of the house are transfered with the sale. To my knowledge, the only way a piece could be "confiscated" would be if the items were from a crime such as a firearm being stolen or various other items with serial numbers and such |
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Valued Member
United States
322 Posts |
Are you kidding, if the guy still alive he will not leave the treasure behind.
He will always remember where his treasure is.
Remember the words, your heart is where your treasure is.
He must die and never told anybody where it is, that is why it was forgotten.
During WWII, when the Japs came to Indonesia. They confiscated or better said robbed everything, including metal fences. People hid all Silver and Gold in the septic tank or buried under the tree. The problem is a lot of people got killed, nobody knew where the hid their wealth.
Samuel tan
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1571 Posts |
I would think, in view of the terms, all frueniture, and decorations, that the painting would be returned. A work of art, is not a 'decoration". The law would have to distinguish between a "painting", and decorartions. whether they are one, and the same
IMHO the painting will go back to the Original owner.
In the US, the "find would, (shopuld), be reported to the proper authorities, and a search made for the legal owner. The "find" would be made public, and any claimants would have to properly identify exactly was involved, in order to prove ownership. There will always be many claiomants, but only one "owner", if he.she can be found, with in a reasonable time. If not, the "find", goes to the finder, and IRS will 'have their way, as usual!
Dick
Edited by livingdinasaur
05/01/2010 12:45 am
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1248 Posts |
court made an interesting decision:
the fact that the farmer held a mortgage is irrelevant and that does not give the farmer any rights on the property, except if the buyer does not honor this commitments
Furniture and decorations is the key here. Furniture , No problem. Decorations, yes.
Lawyers started to argue what it actually means. since this was a civil suit and not a criminal suit, the judge in his wisdom started to ask questions of the farmer and his wife and asked them separately the same questions, one not being present when the other was asked:
Where in your attic was the cardboard box located?
How large was the box?
how many pictures did the box contain?
when did you last time look at the pictures in the box.
Husband and wife had all different answers, simply guessing. However, the smart judge made his NON binding ruling right after the questions were answered and AFTER consulting both parties lawyers.
( Legal beagles knew immediately who was right and who was not, but could not say in court)
the judge ruled / suggested that the proceeds should be divided 20% to the farmer and 80% to the salesman. the lawyers argued in his Honers chambers a bit and settled happily for 25/75.
what:
Legally seen, apparently the seller had more rights than the buyer, as the box in the attic was not considered decorations and was "just forgotten". but by his questioning, the judge made sure that the seller did NOT even know of the existing box! ( farmer had purchased the farm about 30 years previous from a dutch immigrant)
The box, contrary to everyone's believe, was NOT a cardboard box, but was a Settlers oceangoing trunk, locked up with a pad lock without a key, which was stashed behind a whole bunch of old farm equipment and could in fact not be seen unless all this old stuff was removed.
Fact is the farmer could not prove ownership and in fact did NOT EVEN know of the trunks existence. He finally accepted the settlement the judge and the legal beagles worked out..
the judge also indicated that it would be a legal nightmare to truly establish the actual owner of the Trunk and contents, as the Dutch people have died and had NO known kids or relatives.....
it is an interesting ending
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
650 Posts |
Interesting story, I doubt the German immigrant is around if we assume he was 30 when he built the house in the 40s he would be pressing 100 now. Don't be surprised if a family member shows up. He probably should have not have volunteered the name.The amount that he dreams about is probably no where near reality unless its a large collection. And I agree with Hhbkiddo sending to an auction house is scary.
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Replies: 15 / Views: 2,331 |
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Posted 04/30/2010 12:15 pm
