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 Replies: 18 / Views: 3,894 |
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Pillar of the Community
1844 Posts |
Here's what I think about TPG's........................................... Notice the blank space..Yuppers thats what I think of them...I dont .... Ok first of all, I think as coin collectors we should and do all possess an opinion on a coins grade.. I might see it as AU another might say EF....So then here's my issue Why do so many People listen to these firms.. Just because they SAY this is what it grades what makes these guys GODS.... I beleive the only thing these guys should be allowed to do is STRICTLY AUTHENTICATE and not offer their opinion on grades....... I have sent the same coin to the same Canadian place which I wont mention InCanadaCoinShop.........on 5 seperate occasions and got 5 different grades....I also purchased a coin slabbed my the same place ,which was way undergraded in my opinion and sent it back to them..it came back as ungradeable ? Again Why do we need these guys. Would really love to hear HOW CAN WE STOP THESE GUYS FROM GRADING .......Can the CNA , or ANA or any or all these places put a stop to this kind of nonsence.... |
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Valued Member
United States
294 Posts |
For the same reason we have umpires and referees at sporting events. You said it yourself, "I might see it as AU another might say EF....". Somebody has to make a ruling when there is a dispute with the rules. Do they make mistakes? Ask Armando Galarraga. But the coin collecting community has opted to let certain graders make the calls when it comes to determining a coin's condition. At least with the major TPG's, the ruling is accepted by most. Maybe if use expanded instant replay? |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3098 Posts |
Yups, I also think it's more of a standardized "agreement" with the grades. If a TPG says it's a grade, most people buying and selling wouldn't really fight it. I guess you're paying for their opinion, which might be slightly more valuable than yours or any other person's. |
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Valued Member
United States
323 Posts |
Nice baseball analogy LOL
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Moderator
 Australia
16836 Posts |
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...I beleive the only thing these guys should be allowed to do... And herein lies the core of the problem. Who would be these "Coin Police" that allow or disallow aspects of the hobby? Answer: there are none. We police ourselves. As with all self-policing societies, it doesn't take long for a small minority of folks to figure out that ripping off other people is easy to do, and that's exactly what happened several decades ago in the coin industry. The TPGs were the answer to this. In effect, they became the "sheriffs" to whom disputes about grading could be given to. I'm no big fan of the TPGs myself - I think they have caused as many problems as they've solved - but I can see why many people like them. Frontier justice is better than no justice at all. Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1733 Posts |
There are instances where I think they cross the line from offering/selling opinions to artificially inflating prices.
On the other hand I can get a coin graded and move it on to a buyer who isn't so sure of what they are doing.
Double edged sword.
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Pillar of the Community
 1844 Posts |
Nice comments, but I still think they should only Authenticate and its up to the buyer to determine what he or she thinks the coins grade really is..
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1733 Posts |
That might be what you think and there's arguably good reason for thinking it. However these conversations tend to be circular, people/hobbyists would like changes but I still see a market whereby two people can agree (or not) on a raw coin and make a deal. I think most US TPG's offer authentication only if that's all you want. Canadian services offer no real insurance or guarantee on the other hand and really have no "skin in the game" so to speak and as we know from past discussions, I could care less what grade they put on a flip. |
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Valued Member
United States
254 Posts |
There are some people who like to collect coins (they like the designs, history, etc) but don't want to spend the time or effort required to become expert collectors. TPGs give them the ability to collect nicer coins while providing them a "safety net".
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2120 Posts |
I think they should offer the service of just Authenticating. And optionally, if you request it, they can add a grade range. AG - G / EF - AU50 / MS64 - MS65 / etc.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
ianmprice, I would agree with you. Problem is the marketplace doesn't. The last firm that just did authentications (ANAAB) went out of business almost ten years ago.
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Valued Member
United States
294 Posts |
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but I still think they should only Authenticate and its up to the buyer to determine what he or she thinks the coins grade really is.. This is a nice idea, but it's the seller who sets the price, then the buyer negotiates from there. It is important to know how to grade so the buyer can determine an opinion on the grade of the coin in question. The buyer has the option to say, I think the coin grades at this level, regardless of what the slab says. But you know what they say, a seller will always "overgrade", and a buyer will always "undergrade". This is why it's important to have a third party determine a grade. If as a buyer you don't agree with the assigned grade, you can always move on to the next coin. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3692 Posts |
I think that there should be agreed upon ballparks plus details. Meaning, a coin should show no numbers, only general letter grades plus details on why it's "plus" or "minus/about". For example, AU- lacks lustre, no scratches. That's about the only opinion you need. Anything detailed with numbers makes me think that it's systemic crap to get your money. It's just a number with a lack of real human input/output sometimes.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
The decision to buy a coin in a TPG slab is up to the buyer. If you don't like the idea of TPG's I suggest you don't support them. If you get enough people to stop buying TPG slabbed coins their business model will collapse. |
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Valued Member
United States
294 Posts |
Quote:
I think that there should be agreed upon ballparks plus details. Meaning, a coin should show no numbers, only general letter grades plus details on why it's "plus" or "minus/about". For example, AU- lacks lustre, no scratches. That's about the only opinion you need. Anything detailed with numbers makes me think that it's systemic crap to get your money. It's just a number with a lack of real human input/output sometimes. Unfortunately, it was this kind of "grading" that prompted the system as we know it today to come into being. The numbers "standardize" the grading. While it is still opinion-based, the parameters are better defined. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of grading services, and do not buy slabbed coins. But with the difference of a point or two in the grade making a huge difference in the price of a coin, there has to be some standardization. Of course, nothing beats being informed and making your own decision when it comes to buying slabs. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1534 Posts |
The choice of buying slabbed or raw is completely at the buyer's discretion. Some coins I buy slabbed just because I can't find a nice example raw. Don't buy slabbed coins if you don't want but there is no need to bash the TPG's and tell everyone not to buy coins slabbed. If a person is experienced enough in grading and authenticating then they have the freedom of choice. |
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Replies: 18 / Views: 3,894 |
Posted 06/06/2010 6:50 pm
