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1974-D LMC Help Identify Error

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SDcoinguy's Avatar
United States
2424 Posts
 Posted 12/12/2010  4:28 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add SDcoinguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
was looking through my stack of errors and such and found this thing I tucked away a while back. not sure what to make of it. my first thought was that it could be PMD that someone counter-stamped another cent onto the other, but then I saw that the date was also bending with the "lump". so I'm trying to figure out the technical term and how much it might be worth. Thanks

1974-D-LMC-Help-Identify-Error

1974-D-LMC-Help-Identify-Error

1974-D-LMC-Help-Identify-Error

1974-D-LMC-Help-Identify-Error

1974-D-LMC-Help-Identify-Error

Edited by SDcoinguy
12/12/2010 4:29 pm
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tumbleweedtrumpet's Avatar
United States
1418 Posts
 Posted 12/12/2010  4:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tumbleweedtrumpet to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Somebody took another cent and pressed it up against it.
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pyrbob's Avatar
United States
1943 Posts
 Posted 12/12/2010  5:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add pyrbob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The bend in the date is from Lincoln's shoulder under LIBERTY pressing into the date and damaging it.
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John1's Avatar
United States
56855 Posts
 Posted 12/12/2010  5:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks like a vise job to me.
John1
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mcshilling's Avatar
Canada
9164 Posts
 Posted 12/12/2010  6:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mcshilling to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
All I can say it's a small date 74, very interesting coin.
Edited by mcshilling
12/12/2010 6:47 pm
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biokemist6's Avatar
United States
12437 Posts
 Posted 12/12/2010  7:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The damaged reverse rim shows that this coin has been altered
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SDcoinguy's Avatar
United States
2424 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  08:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SDcoinguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
idont get it,

it looks like there is extra copper.. look at the rim
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coppercoins's Avatar
United States
7629 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  08:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coppercoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There is no extra metal, your coin is damaged. It has been hit with a hammer with another coin stacked on it.
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SDcoinguy's Avatar
United States
2424 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  3:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SDcoinguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
but if you see where the "extra" metal crosses over the 4 in 1974 it doesn't make sense to me.

it is raised.. and it flowes perfect. it does not seem to have added metal.
it does look like someone just put it in a vice and impressioned the letters liberty, but how come it doesn't look round like the shape of another penny struck it? I see no evidence of another coin, except for the liberty impressioned on my coin..

look at the rim.. if another penny was hammered to it, the coin must have been pretty HOT to have been impressioned like that and you dont see any other strikes... ALSO..look at the number 4.. if it was struck with another cent, why does it look like then that the one part of the 4 that was HIT is elevated. if it were struck then it would be pressed down, not up..

i cannot believe what I'm hearing.. no one sees the LUMP on the right side? if it were stuck why is it mounded? where did this extra copper come from? the extra liberty is struck in the field, which is lower than the rim.. look at the rim and the field.. the rim and field are the same height.. if it was hit by another penny, you would see a difference in height from the rim and field.. seriously.. am I the only one that sees this?

the coin is not bent. its flat.. so the field is not raised.
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SDcoinguy's Avatar
United States
2424 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  3:49 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SDcoinguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
also, the bend from the shoulder would show the date was also depressed...
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SDcoinguy's Avatar
United States
2424 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  3:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SDcoinguy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
there is no evidence anywhere on the coin that it has been hit with a hammer and penny between it...
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Adam_E's Avatar
United States
4846 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  4:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Adam_E to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
there is no doubt this is PMD. it doesn't have to be made with a hammer, it could be made with a vise, press, ect.
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biokemist6's Avatar
United States
12437 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  5:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biokemist6 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
if another penny was hammered to it, the coin must have been pretty HOT to have been impressioned like that and you dont see any other strikes

Why would it have to be hot? Copper is a fairly soft metal, any type of solid impact will leave a mark.

Quote:
no one sees the LUMP on the right side?

The "lump" on the right side is an indent of the backside of Lincoln's shoulder.

Quote:
look at the rim and the field.. the rim and field are the same height..

And that is the crux of the situation- the rim and fields are NEVER the same height unless the coin has been smashed.

The obliteration of the rims on the right side indicate the site of impact. Only IBERT is visible so the two coins were not aligned when struck which is why the L is missing. On the left side of the coin, you can see the rim impression from the other coin starting at the base of Lincoln's shoulder running up to LIB. Seriously, go grab a hammer and Two Cents and attempt to recreate it- it is really that simple.
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12 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  5:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TwoThirtyTwo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You can clearly see the rim dent from the other coin there also.
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coppercoins's Avatar
United States
7629 Posts
 Posted 12/13/2010  6:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coppercoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There's nothing left to say that nobody else hasn't already said. So I will repeat them again, since that's obviously what the original poster needs to see. This is a damaged coin, to those who know what they are looking at it is quite obvious, and all you are seeing on the coin is the result of it being set face up on a rough surface, another coin placed on top of it, and hit hard with a hammer. This is most likely not a vise job, but I cannot rule it out completely except to say that the marks on the reverse are very indicative of concrete or some other porous, hard surface...not the teeth of a vise.

Either way - the coin is still damaged. There is no error to see here. These are very frequently reported as errors by beginners, and the many of us here who have years and years of experience (I have over 30 years experience myself) seeing all sorts of odd coins reported are VERY familiar with this type of alteration.

Best advice - toss it back and keep looking. You might find something of value if you stop focusing on arguing over this damaged coin and move on to something else.
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Conder101's Avatar
United States
17884 Posts
 Posted 12/14/2010  1:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
why does it look like then that the one part of the 4 that was HIT is elevated.


Quote:
i cannot believe what I'm hearing.. no one sees the LUMP on the right side?

The part of the 4 that was not hit is the RIGHT side of the 4. And that area looks like a raised lump because Lincoln's sholder from the coin that was placed on this one pressed IN the field area and the 197 and left side of the 4. The rim on you coin fit inside the rim of the other coin so the field of the other coin flattened the rim and stongly impressed the LIBER. The rim of you coin and the shoulder of the other coin are the reason why the TY of the other coin was not strongly impressed and why the right side of the 4 was not damaged.
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