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 Replies: 11 / Views: 2,011 |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
11951 Posts |
I see where some forum members are finding VAMs and selling them for much more then they paid. This sparked my interest. So I have been looking at Morgans in some local coin shops. I am finding it very hard to identify any VAMs, but I think I have located one. So the questions. How do you figure out what is the value of VAMs. - I have looked at VAM World and some do not have any price history - I have looked at E bay and did not find the VAM I think I have found Are most here finding these coins to re-sell or to build on their collection. Are the VAMs that are of high value only the top 100 or hot 50 The VAM I think I have located (but not purchased yet) is a 1883 O VAM 7A doubled 18-3, clashed obverse n and us They have it marked as a AU O over broken s and asking $110 I am hoping some of the experts can share some knowledge on how to purchase VAMs. Without identifying this coin correctly it is only a 30 to 35 dollar coin. The mint mark does not show the typical O/S, more like this VAM listed on VAM world |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
709 Posts |
Quote:
I see where some forum members are finding VAMs and selling them for much more then they paid. This sparked my interest. So I have been
looking at Morgans in some local coin shops. I am finding it very hard to identify any VAMs, but I think I have located one.
So the questions.
How do you figure out what is the value of VAMs.
This answer is multifaceted and difficult to answer. There is a bit of a tempest within the VAM hobby over this very question of valuation. Technically a VAM is worth whatever two people agree is a price one is willing to sell for and another purchase at. After that ( in my view only) it gets complicated. There are some who suggest prices on VAMS. Are these based on actual pricing? Based on actual pricing a few years ago? Are they based on sales potential? Are they based on nothing more than what dealers should suggest for them? Are they based on years of personal experience and what is known in the market? The fact of the matter is your guess on pricing is as good as another. Let me speak of personal experience and you make your own value judgements. Take the case of 1901-O VAM 39 A. Two years ago, some suggested a MS 63 specimen was valued at two thousand five hundred dollars. This coin is considered by many to be difficult to locate. Recently a vammer found six of these, all at different times and paid on average around fifty dollars for each. Now you are a beginning vammer and I tell you this is a very neat, very hard to find VAM ( I am not exaggerating) and I am telling the truth. Since I am a very nice guy, I sell it to you for two thousand dollars. You walk away happy, I walk away happy having made one thousand nine hundred fifty dollars. Now there are some who suggest this very coin in MS 63 is valued around five hundred dollars. But is it really? Worth more or less? Remember, this is a very difficult die combination to find. In a private party sale, one MS 63 specimen recently went for ninety dollars. Is this an anomaly? I would reccomend caution in that one of the worse things you can attempt, is to try to find vams for re-sale. Your target audience is likely more experienced than you and you are likely to receive some unwelcome blow back as a result. It is a tough sell. Even for very experienced vammers, who have been in the hobby a long time, they too are recieving blow back as there is a healthy skepticism of current valuations on vams. Edited by Ozland
03/22/2011 11:34 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3076 Posts |
Its a very common coin with no premium value, you are correct its a $30-35 at best coin with where the silver market is right now, that has much more influence on the coins worth that the so called VAM value... The thing is, one must understand,,,,,Is the PERSCPECTIVE of buying and where you fit into the whole of the game BUYING and what the cost is in any commodity depends on where you are in the market place.. are you a common collector? you will pay the top dollar to buy your penny(like RedBook pricing) at RETAIL pricing....Are you a dealer? who has to hold onto this penny until someone comes along while you are paying the rent and electricity to run your shop you can't possibly pay the retail costs....Every buisness has to have a markup value to pay for there expenses to provide you with the commodity you want, thats basic business... however in the VAM game, one can find these coins if you study.. The lists are are simply meant to gather interest in this thing we call vamming...enticing more collectors into the game...Yes there are people making money just like people still collect old baseball cards.. one still has to know what coins are selling and what coins are not worth any thing over the coins silver or normal value due to collectability of the date and mint... In this case understanding what the collectable coins are is not always in the public's eye..you can't go by the I&R ratings...more like the R ratings as some R-7 or 8 coins don't have the bells and whistles VAM collectors go for so the have a low interest rate, for instance the 1899-0 VAM 11A is an R7 coin with very little interest....so theres really not much over the MS pricing values...some but not the huge numbers some coins command... Many a coin can still be found by simply looking and studying and learning what the good VAM's are....and what people are looking for, and more so what years and mintmarks are more collectable.....There is a retail value list called vamview which is published of the retail values.... Vamming in general is a new way to appreciate the Morgan dollar for the many errors which occurred during the minting process, many other denominations also have a following for die errors. Many older minted coins are well known for there die errors as is the CBH 50 cent pieces.... collect what you like....just don't think your going to suddenly strike it rich....there are however many a coin which is worth more than you will pay, and like many items it just depends on where and when you find something...not just for coins....people sell marbles still can make some good money if they can find them cheap and they are the ones people are looking for.... |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3076 Posts |
very well said OZ!!Always good to hear your thoughts...
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3076 Posts |
one must also remember quite well....ALL MORGAN'S are considered VAM'S SO in this case and point....DON'T BE FOOLED just because it says its a VAM... learn to know what you are buying just like any other thing for sale.. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
I have a few 1882 O/S and O over Broken S but never had or heard of a 1883 O over broken S. Are you sure its not an 1882, if it is then I believe all O/S is a TOP100 coin and there used to be allot of interest in 1882-O/S but not sure how much there is now since I haven't looked at them in quite some time
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
11951 Posts |
Thanks for the very informative answers. I can see I will need to go very slow and cautious in buying VAM's. Bryan1315 - In reading your reply I am no longer sure what VAM I was looking at. I should have written down the details. I have looked at this coin a few times because is has interesting die clashes. One coming out the neck of Liberty and the other between the eagle's right wing and the wreath. Just like this one on VAM world 1883 O VAM 7A doubled 18-3, clashed obverse n and us But when you said the O over broken S is 1882 O's I am thinking I have the date wrong. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
I need to say, I am not familiar with every VAM also, so just because I haven't seen one doesn't mean it doesn't exist. I did scroll through VW and I saw a few O/O but didn't see any O/S mentioned for this date. I have a 1882 O over broken S and its a VAM-5 and I believe VAM-3 and VAM-4 is a full S. So if its a Broken S I bet its a VAM-5 1882-O/S but would like to know for sure if you ever go back to look at it again. There is also another scenario that the dealer is just flat out wrong with his attribution and you have the date wright and his O/S is completely wrong. If its the date you think it is, then examine the coin well to make sure its not a O/O instead of a O/S. Every O/S I know of is a TOP100 coin but only the VAM-4 O/O for 1883 is a TOP100. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5618 Posts |
Goldrush, I will say to you, take a deep breath, I would also suggest you frequent the VamWorld site and just lurk around the discussion board, You would be amazed at the knowledge that site has in its members. I would also suggest you find the VAM "Bible" the Encyclopedia for Morgan/Peace Dollars, 4th edition, great reading for informative insights on the hobby, written by Leroy C. Van Allen and A. George Mallis. I think like most things we are interested in, the better the understanding we have on the topic the more decisions made will be that much easier, plus the authors are very unique in that they , Mr Mallis is deceased,May He rest in Peace, but LVA is still doing attributions and is very involved in his "baby"( the study of Vams) they developed back in the 60's. I believe you have been given some prior information, by some of the more experienced, IMO, people here on this site and would also add to take things with a grain of salt, by that I mean if you happen upon a guide of what some people have put together and it's called the top 100 Vams to collect, keep a few things in mind, that list was made up, more than not, by people who SELL Vams and try to keep this in mind, just because the guide states a certain VAM is valued at say $500.00 dollars it might be, if the seller and a buyer can agree on that, my point, just because someone says one thing does not mean it is true, I believe the great OZ has given you above a perfect example of my meaning. I would wish you the best of luck, I hope you collect what you like and collect what you wish, not what others do because actually, collect what you wish and educate your self to know what you are looking at and the general back round of the coins in general, good luck, Mike....PS, Learn that poem!LOL. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
14454 Posts |
At first when you get into VAM's it seems like there is so much to learn you will never be able to enjoy it, that is why most people either just start looking at the coins they already have to see what VAM's they are or they pick a specific date or MM or list to start studying and try to recognize when they see them. I am sure Leroy Van Allen himself doesn't know each and every VAM just by looking at them and heck he can call it and change what ever he wants it to be at any given time (not really just stating that no one knows all VAM's). So just have fun with it and don't try to learn everything all at once because the Encyclopedia of Morgan and Peace dollar Varieties can be very intimidating when just thumbing through it and I have seen people just give up because they are trying to figure it all out at once. It takes time just as it does with any other hobby and if you are not having fun it becomes a chore instead of a hobby |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5618 Posts |
Excellent point Bryan, If the overwhelming addicting passion of the "Adventures of Vamming" gets to be to much, relax, it takes years to become familiar with the nuances of Vamming and it is a very satisfying, enjoyable hobby to become educated with and enjoy what you have learned......Like anything in life worth doing, Vamming is a wonderful topic to place effort in .........
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1353 Posts |
Both Bryan1315 and morgans dad have represented "vamming" for what it is. A learning,enjoyable extension of the hobby.
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Replies: 11 / Views: 2,011 |
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Posted 03/22/2011 11:44 pm
