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So This ASE I Bought, Strange Spots On It.... How To Clean?

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murrellington's Avatar
United States
3276 Posts
 Posted 08/29/2011  11:10 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add murrellington to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I bought this coin and it was advertised as BU. Now it very much so is, it is perfect condition. Well except for a few blackish spots it has on it. Is there anything that can get rid of this without damaging the coin or should I leave it be. I've never cleaned silver so I don't know. Would acetone be a good product for this?

So-This-ASE-I-Bought,-Strange-Spots-On-It....-How-To-Clean?

So-This-ASE-I-Bought,-Strange-Spots-On-It....-How-To-Clean?
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murrellington's Avatar
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 Posted 08/29/2011  11:13 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add murrellington to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I may also mention that when turning the coin and looking at different angles in the light, the spots seem to disappear. When I look in dimmer light and at certain angles, these ugly black areas show.
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amassey08873's Avatar
United States
584 Posts
 Posted 08/29/2011  11:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add amassey08873 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hello Murrelington, I recommend E-Z Zest..Dip. Theirs actually another topic covering a similar issue https://goccf.com/t/96702 that can help. But this will most likely remove these problem areas for you. You dip the coin in it, for only a few Sec. I'd do no more than 3sec to 5sec at the most. I then dip it in a dish detergent and water mix, I premade prior to. Then I rinse with water. Then a final rinse with Distilled water, Pat dry, then let air dry. You run a risk of over dipping if you repeat dipping to many times or leaving it in to long. Just so your aware. Other wise a product I've come to like is MS-70 I haven't heard much feedback on it. But from the few pcs I've used it on, have turned out pretty good. Either one can be easily found but here a place where the price isn't to bad. http://www.wizardcoinsupply.com/pro...aning-coins/
Edited Have you ever tried E-Z Zest
Edited by amassey08873
08/29/2011 11:50 pm
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murrellington's Avatar
United States
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 Posted 08/30/2011  12:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add murrellington to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Cool, I may get a bottle of that stuff. Any other opinions?
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perfessor's Avatar
United States
927 Posts
 Posted 08/30/2011  01:30 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add perfessor to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have a few older ASE's with similar black spots on them. I was wondering what to do with them also. And I already have a bottle of e Z est. I guess I will have to try this.
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murrellington's Avatar
United States
3276 Posts
 Posted 08/30/2011  02:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add murrellington to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
perfessor, if you do try it can you post before and after pics or tell me how it went?
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John1's Avatar
United States
56855 Posts
 Posted 08/30/2011  07:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Your coin appears to be a bullion piece and I don't think you can clean it without damaging it. I suggest you sell it for silver value and buy a new one.IMHO,
John1
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jbuck's Avatar
United States
188770 Posts
 Posted 08/30/2011  11:15 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree with John1. Leave it alone, sell it, and buy a problem free coin. So much can go wrong when dipping silver.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 08/30/2011  12:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I do not like seeing references to E-Zest on this forum without complete explanations of what it does to a coin; without the whole picture, it sounds like a sure-fire problem solver when it is, in fact, the most dangerous thing you can do to a coin you want to keep.

E-Zest dissolves metal from the coin, permanently. That's how it removes discoloration, by dissolving the entire top layer of metal on which the discoloration resides. If you understand the minting process, you know that "luster" on a coin is the result of microscopic irregularities on the as-struck surface of a coin imparted by similar irregularity on the die itself. During the life of a die, as you might imagine, these irregularities wear. A coin struck from an older die might have lesser luster than one from a newer die, or "weaker" luster, i.e., much smaller irregularities which will cause the luster to wear away much more quickly as the coin is circulated.

That's the reason I think twice before downgrading an Almost-Uncirculated coin for the lack of luster - was it struck by a fresh die (luster should last longer) or an old one (luster wears quickly, gotta look in the nooks and crannies where it will remain).

Now, lets start removing those irregularities with acid. That's what you're doing when you "dip" a coin. The number amassey quoted above, 3-5 seconds, is a pretty decent rough figure for the maximum time in a dip which a coin can withstand before being destroyed forever.

A freshly-struck coin, from fresh dies. And that 3-5 second number covers the entire life of the coin. Any more than 5 seconds total, ever, and the coin is done. A coin from older dies will not survive dipping for that long. In extreme cases, the first moment you immerse the coin in E-Zest is the end of it.

Now, tell me about this coin you want to dip. Were the dies fresh? Has it been dipped before?

Don't bother. I'll answer that for you. You will never know how old the dies were - the "aging" I'm talking about can't be seen without 200x magnification, and you'll only recognize it if you've looked at dozens of the same issue at known states of die wear, which is to say you'll never know.

And you'll never know if the coin was ever dipped before, if it was done right. You can't identify a dipped coin that was done right.

Dipping coins is a crapshoot. Every single time. Admittedly, an ASE is a safer bet than, say, a Morgan, but can you be sure someone hasn't already tried to remove those spots before?

Consider dipping as taking a no-less-than 50% chance (probably greater) that the resulting coin will never be worth more than melt again.
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murrellington's Avatar
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 Posted 08/30/2011  1:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add murrellington to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I wanted to avoid selling this and having to buy another, but I guess that is the route I will take.. Thanks everyone for the advice. Thanks Dave for the long explanation.
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Namachieli's Avatar
United States
2120 Posts
 Posted 08/30/2011  1:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Namachieli to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Thanks Dave for the accurate explanation


FTFY.

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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
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 Posted 08/30/2011  1:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I appreciate your taking this as I intended, murrellington. It's my desire to strike an attitude of extreme caution in the mind of anyone considering a dip; there are factors involved not controllable by even the experts in the process.

I'll tell you plainly, the next coin I dip won't be the first. And the next one I destroy won't be the first. I killed an MS65, 1879-S Morgan once - the obverse die was old and the reverse fresh; the reverse came out perfectly and I completely removed the obverse luster with a 4-second dip.

[Fudd]
Be vewy, vewy caweful.
[/Fudd]
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desertgem's Avatar
United States
860 Posts
 Posted 08/30/2011  2:04 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add desertgem to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


The Original formulation seems to be for "rapid" action, whether good or bad. If I have o use it, I dilute a fresh small amount of dip by a factor of about 1:10 parts water and use that and discard after use. It gives me much more time to observe the action and stop it at my endpoint.I agree with Superdave about the danger to a coin. Personally, on a plain bullion coin, I don't care if I lose the luster, so I may use full strength.

Jim
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murrellington's Avatar
United States
3276 Posts
 Posted 08/31/2011  12:37 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add murrellington to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The coin is for my 7070 album, so it is not just bullion to me. If it was for bullion then I would not care about the dark spots. I've never cleaned a single coin before, except for some hideous ones that I have found roll finding. And I guess I will stick to not cleaning coins. I like luster and original surfaces.
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amassey08873's Avatar
United States
584 Posts
 Posted 08/31/2011  01:55 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add amassey08873 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My apologies Murrellington, and thanks Super Dave. I see where I came up a little short, Or a lot when you think about it. I was to casual with my post and Instead of linking the thread with more information, I should of took the time and fully covered it. Cause its not a sure thing, and the odds are almost if not against you, (Depending on history of coin)you'll walk away happy. Your kinda like my mentor(SD) and don't even know it. That goes for a number of members here. So I'm glad before anything bad could of happened you added the most important part. However If Murr. is just going to sell this to buy another, I don't see how a cautious trial could hurt, being its bullion, His Reward to Risk makes for a perfect learning experience. Its risky yes but is rewarding when done right and factors are right. I would recommend seeing just how strong this stuff is, on some common date junk silver. My curiosity was sparked from the beginning, from the secretiveness / hidden art / Taboo of it all, only fueled my curiosity more. So thank you for giving a little session, in proper caution. I walked away with a valuable lesson. By the way the Labels are working great :-)
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murrellington's Avatar
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 Posted 08/31/2011  02:09 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add murrellington to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I guess I could try the solution on it since I am selling it as bullion anyways, but I don't have any cleaning solutions. So I'm not going to buy some just for this. I think i'll avoid it altogether and let others experiment with cleaners. I am known to ruin things, and I think that would probably go the same for coins as well. lol.
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