Reporting Fake Coins

Did you ask for your money back?

some counterfeits are not even detected by some experts, If they are honoring a money back gurantee , they maybe in fact a victim as well, and of course maybe not if you could post a picture of each obverse and reverse that would help we have Morgan experts as well as a counterfiet expert and just about anyother type of expert for any series of coins , some of them are also in the fight against fradulant dealers and sellers, coins and I am sure they can guide you in the right direction. Hang out, and enjoy It might take an hour or 2 maybe even a day or so , but I bet you will get a good honest perspective, with info. and if I know some of these cats it Might be a page or 2 long filled with several links etc. Welcome to the forum JIM. P.s. also don't let one bad deal ruin your chance to enjoy and take part in a wonderful hobbie.

Where did you buy these coins? Based on this, we may be able to offer some advise to you. And, welcome to the forum!

Michael, welcome to the forum! The collective knowledge of this group is awesome and the group is very willing to help others.

I can't see enough detail on the 21S Morgan to make an assessment since the image is a little fuzzy. The image of the 1884 in the white holder (image 37) doesn't show enough to make a determination. What makes you think the 1884 in image 37 is counterfeit? If it were a casting, the granulations would be evident in a closeup. 1884-O is a very common Morgan, so any counterfeits would have been made in large numbers for the volume trade (say, for use at a casino); they are usually fairly crude. Fake 84-Os would not be made for the collector trade.

What we need are images of the Morgans on both sides and, if they're in slabs, pics of them also. If possible, weigh the suspect Morgan; it should weigh 412.5 grains (26.730 grams). Anything less than 400 grains (a very well circulated Morgan) or more than 413 grains would be suspect; a weight within this range would not rule out a counterfeit Morgan, but further tests would need to be done.

It may not be a good idea to contact anyone at this point before confirming suspicions about a coin's representation.

I knew all of the right people would show up Thanks for helping everyone

Michael, good pics! I completely agree the 21-S has a serious "bruise" on Liberty's forehead which, if submitted to a top TPG would probably get her bodybagged (rejected for grading). We've got a couple 1921 Morgan specialists in the group who should be along any moment.

The 1884-O is a different matter. Among the most commonly minted Morgans, the 84-O has some 36 different varieties from about 40 die pairs (according to Bowers, The Official Red Book of Morgan Silver Dollars, the bible for Morgan collectors). There is a lot of variation among Morgans (over 3000 VAMs listed) and I believe this Morgan is illustrative of that variation. It is in Mint State condition with good luster, something which would not be found in a counterfeit of a common coin; almost certainly, a fake of an 84-O Morgan would be a casting, something which would be readily apparent by casting sprues, seams, and a granulated appearance, not to mention a lighter weight although if manufactured for the casino machine trade, it would have enough lead to balance the sorting beams inside the machine. But it then would have a lead-like luster.

The Morgan VAM specialists should be along any moment. SuperDave, you're being called! They can give you a readout of the specific variety which this Morgan might represent.

After seeing these images, whatever you do, don't try to report them as counterfeits. It would be a lot of trouble over nothing.

Fred

Who, me?

I must beg off, at least for the evening. I'm fighting a cold and my alarm, which doesn't care, will be ringing in 6.5 hours like usual. Tomorrow afternoon I'll be back to do some serious looking, but I will mention that the 4 in the 1884 bothers me more than the 1, and the denticles caught my eye as well. I don't know that year well from memory, but we'll have a look and see what's up.

Thanks for the great info. You all really have helped. About the 84 O, I was also concerned that it might be a die variation and if it is I have never seen one like it. Like SuperDave mentioned the denticles are strange. I guess the thing that makes me the most suspicious is that everything is out of proportion, like the fat letters and numbers and they are to close to the denticles on obverse and reverse. When you hold this coin beside a real coin it is more obvious. The 84 even looks smaller. If it is a die variation I may want to keep it right? But I know the 21S has been worked on, like Morgan Fred said, Liberty has a serious "Bruise" on her forehead.

Thanks again!!