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 Replies: 17 / Views: 8,422 |
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Pillar of the Community
Hong Kong
1270 Posts |
The coin looks very well to me; I don't think it is fake. I need more evidence to say it is fake. A bit remnant of silver on the field can't be strong evidence.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5362 Posts |
The coin looks very nice. The color and designs are correct and it appears struck. It looks genuine.
The single concern I have is the way the letters are reflecting light. To me it looks like the corners are rounded not sharply squared. Punched letters on die struck coins have very sharp corners. This rounded look is usually found on only two kinds of coins - heavily polished and counterfeit.
Since the coin also appears to have pinwheel luster (seen on mint struck coins caused by surface flow) there is a third option for this one - poor photographs taken under a bright light at a low angle of incidence which can distort the corners (through reflection) and make a coin appear wrong.
If this coin is not genuine - the counterfeiters involved are reaching a point where photographs will be next to worthless to identify the best forgeries. Can you post pictures taken with light that points directly at the coin (like a scanner).
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
3831 Posts |
I am concerned. This seems to match a batch of some of the super counterfeits I have seen. In particular, the luster matches it. Very difficult to describe but there are genuine concerns. The best place to ask this question is here: http://china-mint.info/forum/ |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6370 Posts |
I called it a fake because the fabric of the coin just looks wrong. The edges of the letters and other devices are not as crisp as I would expect them to be. X2an's concerns confirm my suspicions.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6370 Posts |
Then again, I know absolutely nothing about silver Chinese coins.
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Valued Member
260 Posts |
Probably fake unless you bought it from a trusted coin dealer or something.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1088 Posts |
Anyone happen to know the weight of the fakes?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1088 Posts |
If anyone has data on this coin, please let me know. I just purchased one in an auction. The one I bought has a hole through it. It weighs 26.4 grams, which is under the 27 grams listed however I am thinking the area where the hole is would be the other 0.6 grams.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5362 Posts |
The best way to check a coin with a hole drilled in it is to check the density of the coin.
The density of a coin equals the weight of the coin in grams divided by the volume of the coin in cubic centimeters. To find the volume of the coin weigh it accurately in air and then weigh it suspended in water. The apparent weight loss expressed in grams equals the volume in cubic centimeters because one cubic centimeter of water weighs one gram precisely.
The only thing you need is a scale accurate to 0.001 grams. The kind of scale used by a pharmacist in a compounding pharmacy. They are normally boxed so that air movements do not effect the weight.
The density of struck coin silver (about 900 fine). So even if there is a hole in it your coin should have a density of 10.31 - 10.30 is debased. Over density 10.32 is closer to sterling silver.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1088 Posts |
Thanks for the info Swamperbob. Unfortunately, I do not have a pharmacist's boxed scale. I will have to ask around to see if anyone near me does. Thanks again for the reply.
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Valued Member
United States
414 Posts |
Hello Mr Gurney - it is good to see you posting in the forums again. From my perspective, I don't see anything that would immediately raise alarms but I do have some question areas. The coin has the look of a struck coin and clearly exhibits ample luster. As for the anomalies that several of the members have pointed out (hair, letters, etc), I think some are explained by out of focus images, poor/angled lighting, and posting picture sub-sections instead of one whole image for the obverse and one whole image for the reverse. Secondly, this specific series is riddled with variations, anomalies, spelling errors, etc. I see a good coin with nice underlying luster, correct surfaces, valid details (aside from one or two areas) and am leaning to this being a genuine issue. The dot above the A in "Chine" is not really a concern. Typically, Sun Yat Sen's mustache is poorly defined and flat. Below is an MS62 graded sample which appears to bear many of the same characteristics as the OP coin (thicker T, mushy M, etc), inclusive of a long and defined mustache.  What I can't explain is the following:   Comparing these areas to the genuine image above leaves me  so I'd second the notion for better pictures (whole images please of reverse and obverse). Also, the weight of the coin wouldn't hurt. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1915 Posts |
I have genuine and fakes of this coin and in some cases a person probably could not tell them apart from the photos.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
75143 Posts |
That's a hard one. It looks real, but it's not easy to tell.
Errers and Varietys.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1088 Posts |
Albert, is there a weight difference between your genuine and fake examples?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1915 Posts |
Yes there is but some are closer than others. The giveaways are in the magnetics and density tests as well as others. Weight can be a nominal 20% light or less, but density tests on fake to genuine are dramatic. When I say magnetics, I mean a genuine coin is dia-magnetic and a fake coin often is not. I need to modify that last statement. Among my coins it is true, but there are now fakes made in genuine coin silver (of which I do not have).
Edited by Albert
08/22/2018 6:02 pm
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Replies: 17 / Views: 8,422 |
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Posted 08/25/2015 4:38 pm
