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 Replies: 22 / Views: 6,979 |
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Valued Member
Australia
121 Posts |
Hi, all!
Are there any known examples of 50c coins with rotated reverse/obverse?
If yes, how rare they are?
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Moderator
 Australia
16857 Posts |
50 cent coins are harder to find "rotated" than normal coins, because of their dodecagonal shape. Unless the rotation is exactly 30 degrees out or an exact multiple of 30 degrees, then the shape of the rotated die won't match up with the coin, and you'll most likely end up with a mangled mess rather than a flawless-looking coin.
But yes, they do exist. I seem to recall an old CAB article mentioning them.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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Valued Member
Australia
490 Posts |
Mmmmmm, like the sound of that! Haven't seen one myself and would love to have one or more in my collection!
Drool!
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Valued Member
Australia
490 Posts |
Ok, who's got one /some? Dish up!  |
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
1244 Posts |
Hi, I am unsure how many 50c rotated coins are out there, And on silver stackers they show a rotation in the 2010 COA http://forums.silverstackers.com/to...or-type.htmlI have an armguard security bag opened, as I took my ones out of it for a set, I can have a look through them later on.... Really later on as there somewhere that ill have to really go searching in a pile off coins, and see if I find any. Unsure if this is a common thing or not... but there you go. |
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Valued Member
Australia
490 Posts |
Cool, thanks Australian Coin, I see you hang out on the dark side as well hehehe!
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
877 Posts |
Quote:
Unless the rotation is exactly 30 degrees out or an exact multiple of 30 degrees, then the shape of the rotated die won't match up with the coin, and you'll most likely end up with a mangled mess rather than a flawless-looking coin. If the rotation is not 30° then a rather unusual "castellated" effect can be created. Around the edge metal is extruded to alternate faces at the points. I suspect this error would be most pronounced if the difference in rotation of the dies is an odd multiple of 15°. I have seen a photo of such a coin, and always wanted one since, but can't find a picture now. Maybe someone else has a picture of this very rare error -it is so obviously a weird coin that it is likely to be picked up at the mint or, if released, would be snapped up very quickly. For good information about various errors have a look at http://www.australian-threepence.co...strikes.html. And, check out the beaut 1943 penny in their August 2011 archive too. Jeff |
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Formerly nancyc
Australia
5385 Posts |
Quote:
If the rotation is not 30° then a rather unusual "castellated" effect can be created. Around the edge metal is extruded to alternate faces at the points. I suspect this error would be most pronounced if the difference in rotation of the dies is an odd multiple of 15°.
I have seen a photo of such a coin, I have also seen images of such a coin. I usually copy and keep pictures of oddities like that, but can't find it anywhere in my PC. I think it was a 1983, but not 100% certain. life is a mystery to be lived not a problem to be solved
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
1244 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
515 Posts |
There's a 50c rotation when the blank doesn't engage in the collar (ramstrike) at first and is struck forcing the blank into the collar making "lugs" which , I think a pic you are looking for is here: http://www.australian-threepence.co...n-error.html. Then there's rotataion if the planchet doesn't engage in the collar at all and is struck entirely without collar (I've spilled the beans -see upcoming article of out of collar 50c in February CAB mag). Neither of these are upset. An upset is where one die rotates -the orientation is different for the reverse and obverse dies which shouldn't happen as the dies are keyed into the press. (A luck would have it the key doesn't show in the image but is a flat area at the side of the base of the die)    Edited by the-purple-penny
12/08/2011 05:19 am
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
877 Posts |
Thanks purple penny. I don't know if that is the photo I recall but it shows the error very well.
I had a look at your site; knew there had to be one lurking in there somewhere by could not find it.
Jeff
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
1244 Posts |
So, in normal people language...
If you get a castle type coin it's because it the blank wasn't lined up properly for the stamping mechanism.
And an upset is when the stamp was put in the machine by someone, and it was not lined up -- making a rotated obverse or reverse.
So this would be a quality control thing, I thought they were supposed to make sure the pics lined up and do a test stamp!
Super cool pics.
It so explains how people make clock faces up the key has 12 sides :)
does the $1 die have the same key too
Ooooo can we see pics of the coin with no collar
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Valued Member
Australia
490 Posts |
hmmm, reading the-purple-penny's post (WOW by the way on the pictures - you have some sweet access!)... Quote:
the-purple-penny: An upset is where one die rotates -the orientation is different for the reverse and obverse dies which shouldn't happen as the dies are keyed into the press. So, I understand that a ramstrike (crowning, castleing etc) is possible (well, I know it is as I have several examples in my collection ;-), but that a misaligned die should not be possible because of the "flat" side of the die which should only go into the press in a way to align with its partner die. So I am struggling to come up with how this is possible: http://forums.silverstackers.com/to...or-type.html (thanks again to Australian Coin for this link) I would also assume that the keying or "flat side" on the die is not unique to the 50c and we are all well aware of the $1 rotations... More information leading to more questions in this simple country boy's mind... Edited by steve - Oz 50c man
12/09/2011 09:27 am
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
515 Posts |
The coin in that link is a 30 degree upset, it's upset 1/2th of the dodecagonal planchet (12 sided). There are a number of reasons why this has happened but without more knowledge of a working press (or the RAM working presses) it's hard to say how this occured.
Possibilities:
1.The die could have been incorrectly placed into the press and for some reason the key didn't engage or was faulty.
2. The working die could have been hubbed at the wrong angle when it was made form the master die. Then the key would have been in place but the design angle wrong.
3. The master die was at the incorrect angle when it hubbed the working die.
Mistakes happen to everyone. This is what collectors like!
I'll try get a piccie of the key soon.
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Valued Member
Australia
490 Posts |
thanks purple penny - as always your logic and depth of thought are spot on and us mere mortals welcome and thank you for sharing!
i am still yet to posses one of these babies - I should say knowingly posses as I must confess that this is one error I was not aware of and have not really even checked specifically for, so I may actually have one or more in the hoard... hmmmmmm, more noodling! luv it!
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
515 Posts |
Here we go, you can see the key (in the top pic) on the left bottom end of the die.   |
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Replies: 22 / Views: 6,979 |
Posted 12/07/2011 02:32 am
