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 Replies: 26 / Views: 3,233 |
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New Member
United States
20 Posts |
One caveat beforehand - I tried to find some past threads about this issue but I came up empty.
With regards to price in the marketplace FB (mercs) or FH (SLQ) can sometimes make a large difference in price. What about rainbow toning, especially if it is really spectacular? Can the fact that a 1928 SLQ NGC MS66 (NOT FH) command the same pricing as one that IS FH given this type of toning? In other words, how far above & beyond it's normal station can toning take a coin? I have a specific case in mind, but let's consider it a general question as well...
Thanks,
Jimmy
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Moderator
 United States
23522 Posts |
Toning is a very subjective, emotional criteria for evaluating a coin, unlike FH/FB which is a precise metric wholly dependent on the strike. I have seen cases where nice toning doubled the value of the coin. Look into the Battle Creek Morgans for some good examples, or just about anything Anaconda offers. People who like toners are a very dedicated subspecies of collector, unafraid to make a market in them. It's a fickle market, though, since those who populate it are collecting for emotional reasons. For your specific example, yes, I can easily believe a nicely-toned non-FH coin would easily command the same price as an FH example without toning. Me, I consider toning to be corrosion.  |
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New Member
 United States
20 Posts |
Thank you Dave. As a matter of fact, Anaconda is precisely what I was looking at in this instance. I guess at the end of the day a coin is worth whatever someone is willing to pay, huh?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2365 Posts |
SuperDave very eloquently answered your question...however, I wanted to add that there are some "rainbow tone" enthusiasts here on our forum that may be able to add to your question...possibly on specific coins.
Welcome to the CCF!
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
For the record, I can endorse Anaconda without hesitation. Adrian and Brandon are great people, honest businessmen who trade in some of the finest examples extant. Brandon is one of the finest coin photographers around. They do tend to specialize in toners; indeed, along with Island Coins, they're probably the market maker in that category. If you're willing to pay the price, you will definitely get what you're paying for from them. I still salivate when I think of the PF69 Barber halves they had a few months back. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2600 Posts |
Hi Jimmy,
I read a lot on the sight trying to learn and usually get most of it. However, the vernacular beats me sometime, as here. What is FB, Fh and SLQ, used here. Thx for the patients.
Jim
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Moderator
United States
23522 Posts |
Jim, many issues have details which don't always come out in the strike. SLQ's - Standing Liberty quarters - have hair detail which doesn't always show up. Full Hair (FH) examples have the hair fully struck. Likewise, Mercury and Roosevelt dimes sometimes lack reverse detail, and earn the designation FB (Full Bands) or FSB (Full Split Bands) when fully struck. Jefferson nickels don't always show steps in Monticello on the reverse, and get designated 5FS or 6FS (Full Steps). There are many others. Feel free to ask as you see them. |
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New Member
United States
20 Posts |
quote:
Hi Jimmy,
I read a lot on the sight trying to learn and usually get most of it. However, the vernacular beats me sometime, as here. What is FB, Fh and SLQ, used here. Thx for the patients.
Jim
I'm far from an expert, but I'll clarify as much as I can. SLQ = Standing Liberty quarterFH = Full Head, meaning whether there is a clear fully-stamped outline of the head of Liberty. These are worth more than those graded without FH. FB = full bands - sometimes FSB - full split bands - referring to the 2 bands in the middle of the fasces on the reverse of a Mercury dime. Again, worth more than those graded without FB. I'm sure others could provide a better explanation than I could, but that'll do for a start, hopefully! ~Jimmy |
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New Member
United States
20 Posts |
One other thing I CAN elaborate on is the striking itself.
There are many factors that can cause an imperfect strike - a die in need of polishing, broken or worn punches, stamping pressure too low, etc. Just as in any stamped component, the machine & die condition must be maintained regularly to ensure that all the details inherent in the tooling are transferred to the raw material.
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Valued Member
United States
191 Posts |
If it were me I would wait and spend the money on a FH coin over a toned non FH. Depending on how close to FH the toned coin is...If it were say 75% FH I might consider it.
The way I look at it, you can make it so that the FH coin tones over a period of time....but no matter how long you wait a flat head will remain a flathead.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2365 Posts |
"The way I look at it, you can make it so that the FH coin tones over a period of time....but no matter how long you wait a flat head will remain a flathead".
TBar...I had to chuckle a little but, that's a very good point!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2600 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1247 Posts |
What are called market factors or eye-appeal should be call whimsy because that's all they really are. That markets will put their own value on such things isn't, IMO, anything to cheer about. I'd be rather worried about a "market" that is just a mirror image of us. Rain-bow toning, Full Split Bands, Full Heads, Full Rivets, Split-Tails Full Bell Lines etc, etc have and probably always will wax and wane. Someone can pay thousands of dollars, in auction, for what are die cracks above the eyes on a Morgan dollar. And yet a die crack in Lincoln's Head might be worth $5 on MS60. Lincoln cents are probably every bit as popular as Morgan dollars aren't they? Where's the rational? And even more importantly, how is it that TPGs can presume to rationally quantify the whimsy of the moment  That's the skeleton clacking in the closet. Quantifying whimsy is a contradicting. And at the end of the day, contradictions chew the carpet. |
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New Member
United States
20 Posts |
That was quite a tirade!  I know what you mean - but I think the situation will not simplify in the future. Over time numismatics has gotten more complex with all the factors you mentioned...and I think it will only get more so, not less. I like Ayn Rand also, btw....though The Fountainhead is my favorite... Edited by Prometheus68
01/21/2007 8:02 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1247 Posts |
Unless Atlas shrugs before it has a chance to become more complex. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1267 Posts |
I really can't imagine why people get so fired up and personal about issues like this. If you don't like toned coins, DON'T BUY THEM. It's that simple. Leave them all for me and my fellow collectors who appreciate them. Actually, we won't give you much choice; we will outbid you every time, as those of us who like beautiful toning will be willing to pay premiums for it. (I paid $3500+ for my avatar Battle Creek 1886 NGC MS64, and recently turned down a bona fide offer of $4500 for the coin.) I trust my own competence to determine which ones to buy, and which ones to avoid. I might make a few mistakes here and there, but I bet you'll make some mistakes buying overgraded white widgets once in a while too. We all make a few mistakes ... but they are outweighed by the beauty of the sets we create. And I take the beauty contest challenge any day: put a complete set of beautifully toned coins next to a set of high-grade white coins, and I guarantee you the toned coins will win the eye appeal contest. |
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Replies: 26 / Views: 3,233 |
Posted 01/21/2007 10:59 am
