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 Replies: 38 / Views: 4,403 |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10034 Posts |
There have been several threads for discussing getting rid of the US dollar bill. Opponents of getting rid of paper currency and only using dollar coins said they did not want to heavy coins in their pockets. Proponents were making showing hypothetical situations trying to prove the weight is not an issue. Other ideas - (dubbed excuses by the pro-coin only viewpoint but dubbed as legitimate problems by the pro-paper viewpoint) were discussed such whether or not a person gets too many of the coins accumulating; and whether the cost of things, once a dollar becomes "pocket change," of everything rises so the dollar buys very little. The Canadians cited their personal experiences. And someone even put a link to the news broadcasts when the Loonies and Toonies were introduced. If you want definitive answers, at least view the Toonie introduction since it was broadcast at a time the Canadians had already been using only dollar coins for 9 years (Loonie released in 1987, Toonie in 1996). But viewing all three gives a lot of insight. http://archives.cbc.ca/economy_busi...clips/12064/Note the article is centered on what the name of the (then) new 2 dollar coin will be, but the people continually cite the issue that even the title of the news broadcast, itself, alludes to ... twice: Quote:
'Toonie' makes its debut
Broadcast Date: Sept. 21, 1995
It's time to reinforce Canadian pockets -- again. Following the success of the $1 coin, popularly known as the "Loonie," a new $2 coin will soon weigh down wallets, purses and pockets even more. With two different metals, the coin is an attention-getter, and so is the motif of a polar bear on the edge of an ice floe. In this CBC clip, reporters ponder the new coin's nickname: will it be known as the "toonie" or the "beary?"
Here is a link to the thread - please note I tried to word it to make it as neutral as possible and asked specifically for help from Canadians experienced in using the bills before the Loonie was introduced. Hypothesizing, thus, would hopefully be eliminated by experience: https://goccf.com/t/112063#953274Pllease note not everyone who answered were people old enough to have experienced both. edited to add link to broadcasts  Edited by Earle42
02/27/2012 10:03 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2295 Posts |
Pretty interesting summary.
One thing I haven't heard of about this argument, is that way back in the 1800s and early 1900s, when we had paper money, people also used gold coins. Did people complain about using the coins as opposed to the notes?
I know. Who would complain about a gold coin in their pocket? But isn't it the same difference when concerned about weight? And I know that you could get a lot more with $10 back then than today, but still, as a principle, for arguments sake.
Weights:
Current dollar coin = 8.1 grams
Gold $1 = 1.672 grams
Gold $2.5 = 4.18 grams
Gold $5 = 8.359 grams
Gold $10 = 17.5 grams
Gold $20 = 33.436 grams
Edited by wquinn
02/28/2012 2:03 pm
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Rest in Peace
United States
9104 Posts |
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Weights:
Current dollar coin = 8.1 grams
Gold $1 = 1.672 grams
Gold $2.5 = 4.18 grams
Gold $5 = 8.359 grams A brass buck weighs about the same as a five dollar gold piece. A BB weighs about eight times as much as a dollar note. |
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Rest in Peace
United States
9104 Posts |
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will it be known as the "toonie" or the "beary?" We always called it "that coin with the Queen with a bear behind". |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1796 Posts |
If we want to talk about weight, don't forget the millions of pounds of shredded dollar notes in our landfills that the Treasury throws out every year.
*That* is heavy.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1796 Posts |
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We always called it "that coin with the Queen with a bear behind". Bwaahhhhhhhh.... :-) |
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
10034 Posts |
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I know. Who would complain about a gold coin in their pocket? But isn't it the same difference when concerned about weight? And I know that you could get a lot more with $10 back then than today, but still, as a principle, for arguments sake. Good question, I had no idea so decided to do some research and have fun with numbers. In 1895, Google says a loaf of bread was 3 cents or one 3 hundredth (.03) the value of a gold dollar. The other way of looking at this is to see a dollar would buy 300 loaves. Or, to buy three hundred loaves, all you need is one dollar! Today a loaf is 1.59 (thanks Google). To get your 300 (one dollar's worth in 1895) loaves would cost (1.59 X 300 =) 477.00!  So a mother saying, "Here Johnny, I will give you 477.00 ($1. gold coin), please go run down to the store and buy me one loaf of bread" might not have been a normal occurance  I am not so sure they had very many coins in their pockets - not like people carry today? Granted - this is a quick evaluation. And someone needs to point out the fallacy! I just saw another website of wages in the 1890s that said the weekly wage was 66.00. This would be 13.20 per day. WIth the above scenario, this would make daily wages (13.20 X 477.00=) 6296.00 - I don't think so! I'd keep going, but health issues getting in the way  Anyone game? How much squash could a Sasquatch squash if a Sasquatch would squash squash? Download and read: Grading the graders Costly TPG ineptitude and No FG Kennedy halveshttps://ln5.sync.com/dl/7ca91bdd0/w...i3b-rbj9fir2 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4132 Posts |
If you were going for groceries, a dollar would often have been too much, if a loaf of bread costs 3 cents. Do you go to the store each time you go shopping with one hundred dollar bill? Remember - people didn't have refrigerators so they'd only get perishable items for like a day's worth. They'd be paying entirely in coins, so they'd have a purse or pocket full of coins to pay with. If they did have paper money, they'd have lots of coins in change.
Coins used to get more use, and people carried more coins with them than they do today. Most people today don't carry coins, unless they have a specific need for them (e.g. laundry, bus fare). The rest just drop coins in their change jar at the end of the day.
I'm not saying the weight problem doesn't exist - I'm saying that the way people use coins will make it relatively unimportant. People will dump the dollar coins in their change jar like they do with quarters, and they'll cash in their change jar more often, and get more from it when they do. For the people who do carry coins for bus fare or whatever, they'll be carrying fewer and have less weight in their pockets because the dollar coins are lighter than four quarters.
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Moderator
 United States
187702 Posts |
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...and whether the cost of things, once a dollar becomes "pocket change," of everything rises so the dollar buys very little. Too late, it is already pocket change. Just look at what a dollar bought in 1979 (when we should have eliminated the note in favour of the coin) compared to today. Also compare that 1979 value to 1879. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts |
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A BB weighs about eight times as much as a dollar note. Is that the bare steel ones, brass steel coated ones, newer plastic ones, although not common the Leaded ones, etc?  Dollar coins vs paper currency? Why bother since all you really have to start thinking is all plastic cards. And the way they make clothing today, a pocket full of coins will soon enough end up on the ground.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1231 Posts |
The way kids wear their pants, they couldn't put dollar coins in the pockets or their pants would be completely around their ankles!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
There is absolutely no doubt that coins weigh more than bills & that people will resist any sort of change in their lives. There is also no doubt that minting dollar coins will save the Government money over printing dollars. It's possible that a polymer note might be developed that would have the same cost savings so that should be taken into account. That pretty much sums it up. Personal anecdotes, film clips & non-scientific polls prove absolutely nothing. A well designed poll and/or scientific study may very well prove that people didn't like the change from coins to bills in other countries. However, that's not the issue. The issue is whether or not the savings benefit is enough to justify the change.
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Moderator
United States
187702 Posts |
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The issue is whether or not the savings benefit is enough to justify the change. Exactly. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
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The way kids wear their pants, they couldn't put dollar coins in the pockets or their pants would be completely around their ankles! Maybe that will convince them to pull them up and put on a belt.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2295 Posts |
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The issue is whether or not the savings benefit is enough to justify the change. I think it has been proven many times over, that a dollar coin is many times cheaper than a dollar note, in the long run. Otherwise countries wouldn't have made the permanent change. A change that has been going on for decades. What more proof do you need? Do you need a century of proof to convince you?   Quote:
Maybe that will convince them to pull them up and put on a belt Maybe they won't wear pants at all? |
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Moderator
United States
187702 Posts |
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I think it has been proven many times over, that a dollar coin is many times cheaper than a dollar note, in the long run. Otherwise countries wouldn't have made the permanent change. A change that has been going on for decades.  Quote:
What more proof do you need? Do you need a century of proof to convince you? Would infinity count?  Unfortunately some do not get it; and they may never get it. This is why this topic comes up on CCF again and again. |
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Replies: 38 / Views: 4,403 |
Posted 02/28/2012 2:40 pm
