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 Replies: 13 / Views: 2,763 |
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Valued Member
Canada
262 Posts |
According to Wikipeida [I know, I know]: Quote:
This problem has led to nearly the end of use for a common base metal alloy for everyday coinage in the 20th century, called Cupro-Nickel (also cupronickel), with varying proportions of copper and nickel, most commonly 75% Cu 25% Ni. Cupronickel has a silver color, is hard wearing and has excellent striking properties, essential for the design of the coin to be pressed accurately and quickly during manufacture. However, due to cost reasons, in 2012 only the U.S. nickel among world coins has such a composition. In the 21st century with the prices of both copper and nickel rising, it has become more common to experiment with various alloys of steel, often stainless steel. For example, in India some coins have been made from a stainless steel that contains 82% iron, 18% chromium, and many other countries that have minted coins that contain metals now worth nearly the coin face-value, are experimenting with various steel alloys. Also, other than the mid-1942 to 1945 ' War Nickels' the composition has never been altered since 1866. With the metallurgical value of the metal in a nickel now above 5 cents, and the cost of production over 11 cents, how much time does that have left? Is this the final year or will Congress take its sweet time. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
592 Posts |
Doubting we'll see a change any time soon. We're a very stubborn country sometimes.
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Valued Member
United States
309 Posts |
Yes...very slow evolving.
Hoard 'em if you got 'em.
Or wait 10 years or so, still plenty of time for that.
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21786 Posts |
Actually, Australia's 5 Cent, 10 Cent, 20 cent and 50 Cent coins are 75% nickel, 75% copper, there is no plan to change the alloy.
Perhaps the Australian 5 Cents should be demonetised, the 10, 20 and 50 cents should have less mass.
The Australian $1 and $2 are aluminium bronze: 92% copper, 6% aluminium and 2% nickel. Aluminium provides the gold colour in association with the copper, aluminium and nickel together provide corrosion resistance, and the nickel provides wear resistance as an alloying metal.
Cheap to make, too!
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Valued Member
 Canada
262 Posts |
Quote:
Actually, Australia's 5 Cent, 10 Cent, 20 cent and 50 Cent coins are 75% nickel, 75% copper, there is no plan to change the alloy.
Perhaps the Australian 5 Cents should be demonetised, the 10, 20 and 50 cents should have less mass.
The Australian $1 and $2 are aluminium bronze: 92% copper, 6% aluminium and 2% nickel. Aluminium provides the gold colour in association with the copper, aluminium and nickel together provide corrosion resistance, and the nickel provides wear resistance as an alloying metal.
Cheap to make, too!
 Shows what Wikipedia knows, although there has been talk about getting rid of the 5 cent coin Australia, following New Zealands lead. My country, Canada, probably makes the cheapest circulation coins in the Western hemisphere [probably nothing to be proud of], and with the Loonie and Toonie changed earlier this year, all coins are multi-ply plated steel [except the inner core of the bi-metallic loonie which is still Aluminum Bronze]. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
Quote:
Actually, Australia's 5 Cent, 10 Cent, 20 cent and 50 Cent coins are 75% nickel, 75% copper, there is no plan to change the alloy. Wow 150% coppernickel, must be some thick coins.  |
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Bedrock of the Community
Australia
21786 Posts |
Conder101: Actually, I seem to have the same problems about that quote as you do!
When I wrote the original, I was typing while wearing boxing gloves. Perhaps that explains the typo.
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
2830 Posts |
no, Conder, Australian coins are no thicker than the standards set in 1816, which Oz still adheres to in relation to the sixpence (5c) and shilling (10c). And our 20c is still the same dimensions as the Gothic florin.
Since 1966, our 5, 10, 20, and post-1969 50c, are CuNi 75:25.
I have not heard that a change to dimensions nor composition is in consideration, although speculation is rife.
Last year, on another CCF thread, I calculated the costs of the metal in our coins and, leaving aside all of the other costs of the minting process, the CuNi in a 10-cent was worth about 8.3 cents, if I recall correctly.
I would expect that R.A. Mint and the Treasury would be monitoring this, and has probably had contingency plans in place for years. But there is no point putting them into the public domain, because it is an arid debate for as long as production costs are below the face value of the coins.
Right now, the Australian Government is so busy trying to survive until sunset, that I can't imagine any public servants would get the time of day from them.
I've put $20 on a new PM by Friday.
edited to correct typo
Edited by Peter THOMAS
04/30/2012 9:57 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2295 Posts |
The US Mint is already looking into changing the composition for the cent and nickel. They are currently doing testing on it, as listed in an article in the NN a month or so ago.
I bet the composition for the nickel will be changed next year and this might be the last year or two for the cent.
They might try the composition change for the cent for a year or two and then when they realize that they are still losing money on the cent, they will stop minting it altogether. I think they want to give another metal a try and then once confirmed, stop minting it. Also, I think Canada's idea of not minting the cent, since it is so close to home, will help convince the US government to stop minting the cent, in the next year or two.
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Moderator
 United States
188213 Posts |
Quote:
They might try the composition change for the cent for a year or two... I hope they are not that stupid. However, I would not be surprised if they actually tried to put a screen door on that particular submarine. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2295 Posts |
I hope so too, but the US Mint isn't the one that is driving it. It is the US Treasury. So until the US Treasury says to stop, the Mint will continue to mint based upon demand from the FR on whatever material they decide to use. It'll help reduce the loss, but there will still be a sizable loss.
Technically, the cent should have been stopped about 5 years ago.
The US Mint knows they will lose money on the cent, no matter what material they use. I just think the Mint's Director isn't smart enough to convince the US Treasury to say that it really needs to stop now and not waste any more money minting cents.
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Valued Member
Canada
262 Posts |
Quote:
I hope so too, but the US Mint isn't the one that is driving it. It is the US Treasury. So until the US Treasury says to stop, the Mint will continue to mint based upon demand from the FR on whatever material they decide to use. It'll help reduce the loss, but there will still be a sizable loss.
Technically, the cent should have been stopped about 5 years ago.
The US Mint knows they will lose money on the cent, no matter what material they use. I just think the Mint's Director isn't smart enough to convince the US Treasury to say that it really needs to stop now and not waste any more money minting cents. The US Mint making a Canadian style steel nickel, which costs about 3 cents to produce, may alleviate the problems if the US Mint also switches to a steel cent with an extremely thin layer of copper. Edited by MercuryDime
05/01/2012 8:18 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2224 Posts |
It's going to be a lot longer than you might think to see any composition change here in the US. There are too many special interest groups that are chiming in to keep things the way that they are. They all start off by saying "I'm all for the government saving money, BUT..." and then they quote you whatever agenda they are supporting. It's the same situation with eliminating the dollar bill to allow for the circulation of longer-lasting dollar coins. It will be awhile before that happens, because two of the biggest Congressional supporters of keeping things the way they are are Senators John Kerry(D) and Scott Brown(R), both of whom have substantial respect and support. They are both from Massachusetts, which just (not coincidentally) happens to be the home of Crane & Co., which supplies all of the paper for US currency and has for over 150 years.
Edited by copper nickel daddy
05/01/2012 8:39 pm
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Valued Member
Canada
262 Posts |
Quote:
It's going to be a lot longer than you might think to see any composition change here in the US. There are too many special interest groups that are chiming in to keep things the way that they are. They all start off by saying "I'm all for the government saving money, BUT..." and then they quote you whatever agenda they are supporting. It's the same situation with eliminating the dollar bill to allow for the circulation of longer-lasting dollar coins. It will be awhile before that happens, because two of the biggest Congressional supporters of keeping things the way they are are Senators John Kerry(D) and Scott Brown(R), both of whom have substantial respect and support. They are both from Massachusetts, which just (not coincidentally) happens to be the home of Crane & Co., which supplies all of the paper for US currency and has for over 150 years. True, but eventually, just like silver [RIP], the clock will strike midnight for the current compositions, unless these metal companies can somehow offer the metals for below market value [of course it won't happen]. As for the dollar bill, I agree, it will continue for quite some time into the distant future. |
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Replies: 13 / Views: 2,763 |
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Posted 04/28/2012 11:40 pm
