What On Earth Has NGC Been Smoking?

It is ridiculous, and that's why I'm doing it. I've found NGC's grading to be ridiculous so it's my protest.

You'd think it was a futile attempt, but apparently I'm not the only one that gives them no credit anymore. I've been able to buy NGC coins at raw prices for grades even below what the holder says.

Of course you always buy the coin, not the holder. With NGC, I buy the coin, then I throw the holder out the window (figuratively).

As far as garbage from other companies, yes it does exist everywhere. If we were talking coins slabbed even a few years ago, I'd probably have NGC at number 2. In the last 12 months, PCGS, ANACS, and even ICG have been much better than NGC.

The other 3 are sometimes wrong, but recently I've seen very few that were very wrong. NGC has literally been off by mammoth sized amounts on some coins, which makes me question if they even looked at it. Maybe they just gave it a 2 second glace and moved on to the next one. After all, they're pretty busy these days pushing out silly overpriced high grade modern junk in fancy holders with unique holder designs...all for a select few customers. Hey, it's business, they want a profit. They're not gonna profit much taking way too long on somebody's Half Cent, when they could slab the next few hundred MS-69 "something".

I know that's a bold accusation, but have you seen some of their recently graded slabs...do you really think a supposed expert came to such a conclusion if they actually examined the coin....I'm not sure if they did, at least not any any kind of depth.

YES!

see my post right above yours lol.

I do submit to ANACS and ICG and have been happy with their service, their pricing, and most importantly, their grading.

CAC won't look at them because CAC is basically a company of old-time dealers for old-time dealers. They are slow to change their ways and just refuse to believe that NGC or PCGS could be slipping and that ANACS or ICG are getting better. With a b&m old time dealer in my area, I called in and told him I had certain NGC coin. Since it was NGC, he gave me a quote sight unseen. You should have seen the look on his face when I brought him the slabbed piece of junk (relatively speaking) worth 25% what he offered. He backed out and I couldn't blame him.

Also consider that CAC only certifies a percentage of coins sent to them...and these are probably the coins that dealers thought had a good chance, so most NGC/PCGS coins wouldn't pass the test. I know a non-cert doesn't necessarily imply the grade is wrong, it's just not great for the grade. Still, many (of the pre-selected group mind you) are probably not certified for not even being the correct grade.

Well, first, grading is just an opinion.

Know this though....when a person or business PAYS to have a coin slabbed, they have made another investment into the product (because that is what a slabbed coin really is now). Person is hoping the product grades as high as possible in order to retain a higher investment value (or resale value).

Of interest, when I look at a NGC coin, 85 times out of 100, the coin will grade one point lower than a PCGS slabbed coin in a high MS grade. 50% of the time, in less than MS grade, NGC slabbs are two points lower. (POINT is not a full grade...just a POINT!)

Also of note, grades are just opinions. Grades = Money though...so...either agree with the grade and pay the money....or don't buy.

Do you realize how many coins have been resubmitted to PCGS and NGC in order to get "the grade"? I would LOVE to see how many #2 position in top pops actually exist in their original slabs....as I don't think the population reports are accurate....at all.

Personally, if a coin has the grade and is valued above $200, I will have the coin slabbed by ANACS or PCGS.

I don't think I would risk a $500 or greater value coin in anything other than a ANACS or PCGS slab.

The bottom line....either the coin makes the grade or is does not.


You can test yourself. Grade the coin. Send to NGC. Crack it....and send to PCGS. Crack it...and send to ANACS.

I would even be willing to dontate some funds to this endeavor. Would actually be kind of a fun journey.

Hmmm...what coin would we pick? MS half or quarter from a mint set?

CGB - no, the coins always grade 1 point higher when in an NGC slab. So, if I am in the market for an MS65 coin, I offer MS65 money for an MS66 graded NGC coin....again....about 85% of the time.......again...in MY opinion.

CGB - frustrating. ...and I hear you.

I have, an absolutely original, from an ORIGINAL roll, 1909 VDB.....came back as details, retoned. There is no way this coin is retoned. It IS a stunning, original coin.

To a certain degree, in my most truthful, unabashed, take a step back and look at the big picture, believe that TPG's is like gambling....with YOUR money and YOUR hobby or business.

My reasoning, because there is money to be made...in some instances....a LOT. So, with that, there are unethical people that see an opportunity, and take advantage of it.

With the above statement, believe the TPG's, to a certain degree, do their best to keep the coins legit. With that though, TPG's could be described as a necessary evil. Evil, you ask? Yes, because they are ALSO making money off of the hobby/business.

CGB - your frustration is legit. I don't have an end all answer for you, other than, it is what it is.

This was just one of a few problems I experienced with NGC when they refused to place the variety on the slab, even though I noted the variety and paid the extra fee...
In the NGC holder it would have been a $36.00 coin and in Cherry Pickers it lists at $500.00 (in fact this coin is graded higher then the plate coin)..

CGB - OUCH!

I have a 1882 CC GSA Morgan (in the GSA holder) that is a LOCK 64+ or 65....came back as a 63.