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Change Our Currency's Denominations? - My Latest Coins Rant.

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SteveCaruso's Avatar
United States
1796 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2013  10:15 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add SteveCaruso to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Poll Question
The problem with most of our coins nowadays (especially the lower denominations) is that they're spent only in one direction: Businesses give them out as change to customers and customers hardly ever give them back. Businesses are then forced to make additional change orders from the bank and the cycle continues.

What we *really* should be doing is re-denominating our currency to make our coins *worth* something again. Get rid of the penny, nickel and quarter, keep the dime, resize the half dollar. That would make everything round to the nearest 10 cents.

Gasp! Get rid of pennies, nickels, and quarters? Won't people complain? -- Remember when people complained about getting rid of the Half Cent? Of course not. It was discontinued back in the mid 1800s when it was worth over 12 modern cents because everyone thought that value was too small to do business with. Get rid of quarters? What about coin-op laundromats? If you can tell me where you can wash and dry a load for less than a buck nowadays, please tell me. Which brings me to my next point:

We need to get rid of *all* bills lower than $20 and replace them with coins. Why? The new higher-denomination coins would then be on par to what their lower-denomination counterparts were worth 60 years ago. You could *actually* go into a store and use a single coin to buy a bagel and a coffee, rather than having to fiddle with 3-4 bills. No one complained that long ago about the "inconvenience" of using something the size of a nickel to buy a loaf of bread, and nowadays $20 bills are the mainstay anyways. How many ATMs give out smaller bills than that? Nearly none.

Because of this gain in relative value we'd see coins properly *circulate* again. They'd move in and out of businesses both ways, and as a result we would have to mint fewer of them, and save billions (yes billions) of dollars in the process as coins last upwards of 50 years and are completely recyclable. In contrast, bills are shredded and end up in landfills after only a few years and are a horrid waste.

What do *you* think?

Poll Choices
 I'm for it.
 I'm for it, but keep the penny and nickel.
 I'm for getting rid of small change, but leave bills alone.
 I'm against it.
 Other (explain)

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CoinsKelly's Avatar
United States
3453 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2013  10:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CoinsKelly to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Interesting thought (and what a way to come back!).

Before I vote, I wonder how many machines that accept the current demonimations would need to be refitted. How would that work with your suggestion?

Edited by CoinsKelly
01/19/2013 10:27 pm
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SteveCaruso's Avatar
United States
1796 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2013  10:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SteveCaruso to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I feel it's a matter of we'll have to take that medicine sooner or later, might as well get it over sooner in such a manner that will last for a while, rather than be forced into several, layered sub-par kludges over a longer period of time. :-)

The savings alone in that period would be worth it.
Valued Member
TJB17's Avatar
United States
492 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2013  11:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TJB17 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'd be for getting rid of the $1 and $2 notes and replace them with coins like Canada did, but not the $5 and $10 notes. Right now if you drop a coin, the most you're out is a buck, but probably much less. I'd be really mad if I dropped/lost a coin and it was a tenner or even a fiver.
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larsdog's Avatar
United States
593 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2013  11:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add larsdog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree with get rid of pennies, nickels, and quarters. I also agree with keep dimes and halves, but I would bring back the 20c coin in your scenario. $1 coin for sure and no paper money less than $5. Do we need a $2 coin as well? We could keep a small number of $1 bills floating around for strippers like we kept some silver dollars available for the slots in Vegas!
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SteveCaruso's Avatar
United States
1796 Posts
 Posted 01/19/2013  11:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SteveCaruso to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Right now if you drop a coin, the most you're out is a buck, but probably much less. I'd be PO'd if I dropped/lost a coin and it was a tenner or even a fiver.


In my experience, it's worse when higher denomination bills stick together. "Whoops, I spent $20 rather than $10" and when dealing with new bills it happens a lot. :-)
Valued Member
Derek's Avatar
United States
125 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  12:08 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Derek to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am for it, but I have something I want to say in response that some of you might think is interesting. Now say they replaced the $5, $10, and even $20 bills for coins instead? I could be mistaken, but the process of counterfeiting coins could (possibly) be easier than paper money, due to security features that couldn't be placed on/ within them. Most of the time this probably wouldn't be an issue, since people would probably cast them, which those are obvious to detect. What do you guys think? Would there be a resurgence in counterfeiting coins?

I know what you mean about that, TJB17. Could you imagine would you would accidently drop in a storm drain? Nightmare! :O
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SteveCaruso's Avatar
United States
1796 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  12:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SteveCaruso to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well, there already is a huge surge in counterfeiting, of every denomination of every coin and every bill. The so-called "supernotes" are really scary and they already circulate unnoticed. I've also come across two counterfeit Sacagaweas in circulation (given that's out of many, many thousands I've handled, which so far is better than bills). We need to up the ante on anti-counterfeiting measures *currently* on everything we mint and print.
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Derek's Avatar
United States
125 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  01:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Derek to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Would you happen to have pictures of those counterfeits, so that we know what they look like? I've seen counterfeit bills, but never of contemporary US coinage.
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basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  02:31 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I say other. I think all the coins could stay in collector versions. If were talking buying power the penny and nickel should go and really the dime and quarter as well. I'm all for getting rid of the penny but if we nuke everything up to a half thats quite a large range for rounding which will increase the cost of living. A drastic change like this would need to be done over several years if not longer as well to prevent shock with the general public.

For bills id be fine with a dollar coin but for now 5 dollar bills can still buy plenty and I just dont see the public being happy about coins up to a 20. If your going to go that drastic you might as well just get rid of bills all together since that would basically leave just a 20 and a 100 as common bills that get used.
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yotie's Avatar
United States
3077 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  08:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add yotie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
well I believe at some point in the future the gov is gonna haffta do some thing drastic with our currency I could see a $5 coin and a $500 bill with the cent and five cent pieces and quarters removed
the new dime could be made of copper the new half could be made of nickle and bi metal for the $5
Edited by yotie
01/20/2013 08:58 am
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SteveCaruso's Avatar
United States
1796 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  09:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SteveCaruso to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Would you happen to have pictures of those counterfeits, so that we know what they look like? I've seen counterfeit bills, but never of contemporary US coinage.


I'm going to be posting their profiles here and there to The Black Cabinet over the next month so I'll toss you a private message once it's up. It basically looks like so-so struck Sac, except that it's made of solid brass. They made these by the millions in South America where American coins already circulate alongside local currency.
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muddler's Avatar
United States
7185 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  10:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add muddler to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There is interesting advise and meaning to revamping our money. Unfortunately our government cannot make a single decision without over analyzing sending it to committee filibustering and then rejecting change. If you always do what you have always done you will always get what you always got. We refuse to stop printing the dollar bill when we have a viable replacement. The can continues to be kicked down the road, eventually this can will rust and disintegrate. Then and most likely only then will our $ be revamped or scrapped for a new monetary system.
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ninamason's Avatar
United States
1227 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  1:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ninamason to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I disagree.

By all means, get rid of the penny and even the nickel; change the $1 to a coin and make the $2 readily available. I'm onboard with these changes.

BUT: devaluing money like a $10? NO!! This will make inflation SKYROCKET as people get used to thinking of ten bucks as "pocket change." And that doesn't even begin to touch on the billions of dollars to revamp things like vending machines, cash registers, tollbooths, car washes, etc.


Also, I disagree strongly with your "the $20 is the mainstay" argument. I work at a gas station and after the $1 bill, the most common denomination I see is the . . . . . quarter. And after that, the $5.

All around a bad idea, I'm sorry. No.
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Libertad's Avatar
Canada
3692 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  2:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Libertad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't like your idea of getting rid of bills smaller than $20. It would be harder to keep change in the tills as opposed to stack of papers. Keeping the dime is just a hassle because of its size. The whole monetary system would have to change and revolve around a 1/10 of a dollar. I would think that a devaluation would have to occur then, but I'm not an economist.

Here's an article that suggests something plausible. It recommends using only 3 coins: 1 dollar, 1/4 dollar, and the nickel with a new composition. The whole rounding issue wouldn't be a problem because of a competing market ("We round down!", or buying in bulk to save a nickel). http://www.numismaticnews.net/artic...-all-we-need
Edited by Libertad
01/20/2013 2:57 pm
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Earle42's Avatar
United States
10034 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2013  3:41 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Earle42 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
We non-metropolitans use even pennies daily in our cash purchases (yes - we are not all dedicated to plastic or smart phones yet). We still have frequently used take/leave a penny dishes at registers.

As to dollar coins, this is something discussed here ad nauseum. Look up some of th posts and you will see its not all as cut and dried as sometimes said.

I even went to the point in one of the threads to question the Canadians who went through the transition years ago. The very things which are normally said to be irrelevant (such as weight of the coins in pockets) were verified by the Canadians telling me (which I already knew from being closely associated with Canadian culture all my life) were actual issues that did affect them. Its just after 30 years of the Loonies being out, and a new generation not remembering the bills, that the Loonie has become an icon to them.

Their prices did increase when the dollar psychologically became the new quarter - the the point a Toonie was needed (and again was not favored by the public until forced on them). Another thing is that you will find they also tend to just throw them in a jar and save them, cashing them all in at the bank later - b/c they get too many to carry around - sound like what started this thread - about the coins not being used?

Then their are issues not taken into account in the government studies about extra costs of the individuals who will have to transport large numbers of metal vs paper. I DO believe in the end the metal will eventually bring some savings. But the costs incurred have not totally been taken into account. Where I got this idea/info from was the Canadian banks I used to visit. When they heard of the Sacs first coming out, the bankers were telling me how they did not think the US would follow their bad example. Their complaint was that it cost so much more for them to ship large quantities of them, that they had to increase costs on everything else. So again, the little man gets it. The government may be able, on paper, to show where tax payer dollars are saved. But it also costs the taxpayers more out of pocket money. So I do not know if the taxpayers actually win all that much - if at all.

There probably are better ways of fixing the problem. I personally would rather not see everything go up in price - things are way out of reason now. I notice a silver dime still buys as much as it did back when they were in circulation. I'd like to see some system based on something with legitimate value other than debt/government good will.


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