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 Replies: 20 / Views: 5,779 |
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Valued Member
United States
165 Posts |
OK who is the small motto expert out there?  |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
36782 Posts |
It appears to be a small motto but I'm not 100% sure the coin is genuine. Can you post more photos of both sides.
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Valued Member
 United States
165 Posts |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
36782 Posts |
Photos are still a little hard to see. Here are photos of a genuine small motto for comparison. Yours might be genuine but still not sure based on your photos.   |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3453 Posts |
It looks like a small motto but the details in the banner and branch bother me. It could be the pictures (which are better than I could take) so I would see who else chimes in on authenticity.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
9792 Posts |
Cleaned and recolored if real, we need much better photos to be sure. The motto is correct for the small motto variety. It looks more bronze colored than I've seen on real ones, that could be it's from China, they have a very nice die set to make these with. I haven't run across one for sale yet, other than when the sold "Replicas" on ebay last year. Now I'm wishing I had purchased a set of them for Counterfeit Detection aids. Is there any doubling on the IGWT motto, top of the letters? Is there a full top serif on the D in United on reverse? I'd say from what I can tell it looks pretty good from the small photos, I'd put the grade at VF30 and details for the recolor job and cleaning. Still a very desirable coin if it passes the genuine test! "Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013! ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1981, ANS, Early American Coppers Member (EAC), Colonial Coin Collectors Club member (C4), Conder Token Collector Club member (CTCC), Civil War Token Society (CWTS) member, Liberty Seated Collectors Club (LSCC) & Numismatic Bibliomania Society member (NBS), USMex, Member in good standing, 2¢ variety collector. See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440Edited by westcoin
02/28/2013 04:34 am
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Valued Member
United States
165 Posts |
I believe the discoloration/toning came from the old vinyl flip the coin had been stored in or the last 30 years. When I found it there was almost a sticky sweat" layer on the coin and when removed from the vinyl there was a sweat impression in the vinyl. I put the coin in mild soap and water and blotted with a soft cloth and the residue came off. I saw it as the lesser of two evils. I attempted to show the areas you questioned in your posts. Do these new pics answer any questions for anyone.It appears the serif is full. I see a poor strike on the motto but no doubling. thanks and I really do appreciate the opinions and comments. Gaz    |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3453 Posts |
Thank you for posting the updated pictures but I am still not convinced it is authentic. The banner, branch and berry still look off to me - I am not an expert, just giving you my impression.You may also consider taking it to a dealer if you are not sure it is authentic.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
9792 Posts |
THat stickiness you describe that coated the coin is a mix of the byproduct of the vinyl filp the coin was stored in, it is PVC which can turn into an acid, to completely and safely remove it you need to soak the coin in acetone for a few minutes, any thicker areas can be dabbed at with a q-tip lightly. This will preserve the current condition of the coin, please don't store it long term (more than a few weeks) in a soft flip. I also agree you should have this piece at least looked at by a dealer. Though not all are familar with the 2¢ series in any depth. A TPG would say for sure, I'd use ANACS if you are keeping the coin or PCGS if planning on selling it. "Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013! ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1981, ANS, Early American Coppers Member (EAC), Colonial Coin Collectors Club member (C4), Conder Token Collector Club member (CTCC), Civil War Token Society (CWTS) member, Liberty Seated Collectors Club (LSCC) & Numismatic Bibliomania Society member (NBS), USMex, Member in good standing, 2¢ variety collector. See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440 |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
I would have to go withthe majority here, I am about 90% convinced it is a fake. The grade is high, the strike is strong, but the leaves in the wreath around the shield are rounded and mushy. It just doesn't look right.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
5953 Posts |
At first glance it seems to be Fake but I think its mostly because of the pictures. An Acetone bath is a must soap and water will not remove all the PVC. Take a loupe and look closely at the reverse Typically there will be some Longacre doubling around the lettering. I assume you are holding the camera when shooting these pictures which might explain the unusual distortion in the lettering. Any chance of some close up pictures of the arrow feathers, the WE and the berry between the we and the left arrow.    |
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Valued Member
United States
165 Posts |
I'll get to it this weekend. Thanks everyone.
Gaz
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Valued Member
United States
165 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
5953 Posts |
They are an improvement on the last pictures but they have me concerned. the central veins on the wheat leaves are missing. these should be visible especially near the ribbon. here is one of a slightly lower grade.  I am still leaning towards it being real though not quite so certain. I am sorry but your pictures are just not quite good enough for me to be certain. in hand I would tell you in a couple of seconds. The only thing that would give it the mushy look it has would be a whizzing in the past. If you have a loupe you should be able to see the evidence of mechanical polishing. I doubt that its fake because all the fakes I have seen to date have been well struck and centered yours is slightly off center and this is a fairly common thing amongst 2 Cent coins. With the grade and the potential problems I would recommend sending it to ANACS but only after you have washed it in acetone to remove the soap residue and any remains of PVC. If you have a scanner you might want to try that to get a better image. This one has been lightly whizzed but it still retains some of the detail yours does not.  Edited by nohope587
03/02/2013 6:28 pm
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Valued Member
United States
165 Posts |
I dropped this off to Stacks in NYC for an opinion and a TPG . He was fairly certain it was authentic in spite of the banner. He did say it had been lightly wizzed but the coloration did not concern him especially since it spent 20 years in a POVC flip. I'll keep you posted. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
9792 Posts |
Great news Gazot! That is a great grade on a tough coin.
"Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013! ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1981, ANS, Early American Coppers Member (EAC), Colonial Coin Collectors Club member (C4), Conder Token Collector Club member (CTCC), Civil War Token Society (CWTS) member, Liberty Seated Collectors Club (LSCC) & Numismatic Bibliomania Society member (NBS), USMex, Member in good standing, 2¢ variety collector. See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440 |
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Replies: 20 / Views: 5,779 |
Posted 02/27/2013 9:05 pm
