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Interesting 1848 N-6e Large Cent

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Pete2226's Avatar
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 Posted 05/12/2013  4:45 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Pete2226 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
The interesting feature of this 1848 N-6e, is that there is no Retained Cud on the rim at MERI. The section of the die in that place is, in fact, shifted outward - as can be seen by observing the positions of the dentils on that section. Some of the lines over UNITED are also visible.

Does anyone have any comments on the absence of the Retained Cud? I have not been able to find another example.
Pete


Interesting-1848-N-6e-Large-Cent

Interesting-1848-N-6e-Large-Cent

Interesting-1848-N-6e-Large-Cent

Interesting-1848-N-6e-Large-Cent
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
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 Posted 05/12/2013  5:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not to argue semantics, but your coin is a perfect example of a Retained Cud. The piece has wholly broken from the die, yet is still roughly in place. That's what a Retained Cud is. Your example is about as late a die state as I've seen; one can't imagine the die surviving many more strikes.
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 Posted 05/12/2013  5:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Pete2226 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for that information. I thought that a Retained Cud was the raised area on the rim. I had not seen any images of N-6e without the raised area. I am having difficulty visualizing the process the die is going through. Intuitively, I was thinking that the raised area on the rim would have been a stage later than what I am seeing on this coin. You, I think, are suggesting that the raised area comes before seeing what is on this coin. So how did the raised area disappear?
Thanks for your help.
Pete
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Pete2226's Avatar
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 Posted 05/12/2013  5:35 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Pete2226 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Okay - what I have been calling the raised area on the rim - is that a Retained Cud with vertical displacement? This would mean that the Retained Cud on this coin has horizontal displacement. How would you know which came first?
Pete
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
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 Posted 05/12/2013  5:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes, this one shows just the tiniest bit of horizontal displacement. Probably not even visible; it only moves under the enormous pressure of the strike. I think any vertical displacement of a Retained Cud kind of depends on the shape of the broken piece - the more wedge-shaped it is, the more likely it'd be to move vertically and then usually in a downward direction (which would make it appear raised on the coin). All of this only happens because (as is common) the reverse is the anvil die, so gravity keeps the Cud in place.

This one's the latest die stage; you can find examples with much lesser degrees of cracking at that point.
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