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Spanish Half Reales Cobs

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Author Previous TopicReplies: 11 / Views: 11,776Next Topic  
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MathieuMa's Avatar
France
1591 Posts
 Posted 08/03/2013  5:21 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add MathieuMa to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
thq - as you like those ... here is a couple nice ones :)
Got some others, but ... no pictures on hand.

Felipe II, Lima, Diego de la Torres
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Felipe IV, Lima, 1656 (special type with cross on both sides) :
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Felipe V, Lima :
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Carolus II (Lima) had a nice monogram as well :
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Carolus III :
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Ferdinand VI had a different monogram, but I don't have beautiful examples Dated though ... but not complete
From Lima :
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
And Potosi (one of the coins pictures in the Calico ) :
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Edited by MathieuMa
08/03/2013 5:23 pm
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tokenmast's Avatar
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648 Posts
 Posted 08/03/2013  8:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tokenmast to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
WOW

VERY NICE!

Pardon the shouting.

Is it typical to have the planchet with 6 sides? Carolus II (Lima) or 8? did they keep cutting till the weight was right?
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thq's Avatar
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3343 Posts
 Posted 08/03/2013  9:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add thq to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Beautiful coins! Is the first one a royal? I have one with some peripheral detail but not nearly as much. As to LVIS really being Philip - a 1725 LVIS would be better than a 1727, but it will be a long time before I find one, and until then the 1727 has the monogram which is all I was after.

I have very strongly struck Carlos III which has almost the entire monogram, but on the horribly shaped cob it's very strange looking, like maybe it came from outer space. If I can get a decent photo I'll post it.
"Two minutes ago I would have sold my chances for a tired dime." Fred Astaire
Edited by thq
08/03/2013 9:28 pm
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1962 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2013  08:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add realeswatcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I have very strongly struck Carlos III which has almost the entire monogram, but on the horribly shaped cob it's very strange looking, like maybe it came from outer space. If I can get a decent photo I'll post it.

Charles III Potosi cob half R are rather scarce, I find... especially with decent strike and clear date showing.


Quote:
As to LVIS really being Philip - a 1725 LVIS would be better than a 1727, but it will be a long time before I find one, and until then the 1727 has the monogram which is all I was after.

Note that for Lima/Potosi half real pieces, as relates to Philip V vs. Luis... when someone says a piece "is" Luis, that means it displays the proper LVIS monogram. If the PHILIPVS monogram is showing, then that piece "is" Philip V.

So, for Lima, the only date that shows a LVIS monogram is 1725... all of that date are Luis, as far as I've seen. As mentioned, at least at some point, either Calico or Cayon's book listed 1726 Lima as Luis, but this seems to be incorrect - every 1726 Lima I've looked at is Philip. Don't bother looking in Krause... the Spain/New World issue simply (incorrectly) omits any separate reference to a Luis 1/2R.

DO note that the monograms can look similar to the untrained eye, which lends to the confusion. Other times, laymen aren't very good at deciphering old-style digit font, and also can be wrong about the positioning of the digits. Additionally, of course, everyone likes to think they have gold, so sometimes people see things which isn't there.

For Potosi, the dates 1725, 1726, 1727 are considered to exist with a LVIS monogram. All 1725 and 1726 pieces are Luis; 1727, I believe, can also exist with a Philip monogram.

From unscientific observation, the 1725 Potosi LVIS 1/2R is the most commonly seen Luis Potosi 1/2R... 1726 and 1727 are less frequently encountered.

Sedwick's Practical Book... cobs primer I know has pics of clear (correct) LVIS monograms for the different mints'half R, and possibly some additionally info.
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MathieuMa's Avatar
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1591 Posts
 Posted 08/04/2013  11:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MathieuMa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
thq : the fist one not royal, just minted by Diego de la Torres, which took great care in the minting of his coins :)
It's indeed superb.
I'm waiting to see your Luis, whatever year it is as lont as it has the monograp - it's better than my corrosion-eaten-one-with-wrong-monogram (and thus, not from Luis I ...). The only ones I've seen are from books :D (including Sedwick's one)

Regarding the shape, it seems quite common for the Carolus, I suppose depending on who was at the head of the mint they would prepare the planchets in different ways.
The idea was to get properly weighted silver before striking those - it must have been a complicated job (compared to higher denominations)
Edited by MathieuMa
08/04/2013 11:58 am
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thq's Avatar
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 Posted 08/04/2013  11:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add thq to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My 1727 LVIS came from Sedwick. He attributed it to Lima but maybe it's Potosi.

Whoops my bad. It is a 1725. Sorry. But thanks for ALL the information.
"Two minutes ago I would have sold my chances for a tired dime." Fred Astaire
Edited by thq
08/04/2013 12:04 pm
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thq's Avatar
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3343 Posts
 Posted 08/05/2013  2:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add thq to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Here are the 2 1/2R's I discussed. First the 1725 Luis:

Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Now the 1765 Carlos III:


Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

I've seen an argument that the monetary symbol for dollars $ comes from the Potosi logo on the bigger Spanish colonial coins. I think the LVIS monogram does a better job, though the 1/2R is too obscure a coin to have been the source of $.
"Two minutes ago I would have sold my chances for a tired dime." Fred Astaire
Edited by thq
08/05/2013 2:26 pm
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1962 Posts
 Posted 08/06/2013  07:39 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add realeswatcher to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
1725 (Lima) Luis, 1765 (Potosi) CarIII, both clear dates and identifiable monograms. Solid examples.
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MathieuMa's Avatar
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1591 Posts
 Posted 08/09/2013  05:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MathieuMa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for sharing those thq, they are superb ! I've seen my first Luis monogram, thanks to you :)
I like how the Carolus III is crude - and at the same time close to how it was struck.
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 Posted 10/30/2014  2:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Gerryo267 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I found this little cob in Mexico. I know is a half real because of the weight. Can you please help me identified this coin? Year and history.
Thank you very much.

Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs

Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Edited by Gerryo267
10/30/2014 3:20 pm
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thq's Avatar
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3343 Posts
 Posted 10/31/2014  12:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add thq to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It could be Philip III monogram, Mexico ca 1598-1621. A very unusual shape, like a mini klippe.

Another possibility. The irregular shape and position of the M might make this Philip V. The assayer mark looks like a D, which would date it 1726-28.
Compare this irregular 1733 Mexico 1/2R:

http://auction.sedwickcoins.com/Mex...re_i20694462

Unfortunately your coin has no date.
"Two minutes ago I would have sold my chances for a tired dime." Fred Astaire
Edited by thq
10/31/2014 12:51 pm
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MathieuMa's Avatar
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1591 Posts
 Posted 11/04/2014  10:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MathieuMa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Sorry for the small pictures (I didn't took new ones) - here is how it looks when more complete :

Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
Spanish-Half-Reales-Cobs
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