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Fraud Through Paypal Question

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coinmancanada's Avatar
Canada
4 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  10:42 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add coinmancanada to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hi - I just joined, this is my first question. I have some notes I've been selling on Kijiji, I usually meet in person and deal in cash. I have a high-value item I listed the other day, someone contacted me who would like to pay for it with Paypal. I have no problem with Paypal (I also do eBay/paypal), but I am suspicious of his intentions because of the lack of overall communication, and that he wants to do this via paypal and (I assume) then having it shipped, instead of meeting in person. There is no feedback rating system, etc, with Kijiji.

Maybe he's too far away to meet in person - that's likely - but he hasn't said that, just keeps repeating in the emails "just send me your paypal email so that I can make the payment. hope I can count on your integrity during the course of this transaction"

It seems the security with Paypal is all on my end - he's offering to pay through Paypal first, and hasn't even discussed how he would like it shipped/pickup yet. It seems too easy. But how would someone actually scam you through Paypal? In this situation it seems like it would be much easier for me to scam him. (Not my intention at all, for the record).
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BadThad's Avatar
United States
19942 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  10:48 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BadThad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
He could open a paypal case against you after he pays - it could create a headache for you. Also keep in mind, as the seller, you'll have fees removed from the payment.

If the buyer is that serious, tell him to send you cash or a money order. He can transfer the paypal funds into his bank account (if he doesn't have cash).
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jimbucks's Avatar
United States
4691 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  11:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jimbucks to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Have him give you his Paypal info and you can send him an invoice. That way you will know if he has a valid Paypal account and can check his history.
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westernsky's Avatar
United States
7617 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  11:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add westernsky to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Welcome to the forums!

Sounds fishy to me. I wound not want to accept a PayPal transfer for an item I sold through kijiji or Craigslist. It's risky enough having to do it through ebay.

Why is he in such a big hurry?

My only guess is it's either fraud or he is afraid you are going to be offered more money for it from someone else because you sold it too cheap.
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coinmancanada's Avatar
Canada
4 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  11:30 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinmancanada to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have read since writing that Paypal always sides with the buyer if they claim the delivered packaged was empty, and refund their money right away. hmmmmm.
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westernsky's Avatar
United States
7617 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  12:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add westernsky to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Paypal will side with the Buyer unless you can prove 100% that the item that was advertised was delivered to the Buyer. The only proof of delivery that is accepted by PayPal is signed delivery confirmation VIEWABLE ONLINE from a recognized shipping company like the postal services, FedEx or UPS. Even with that you are not completely out of the woods.

I would only do this face-to-face, in a very public area with cash. If the buyer balks then you know it was fraudulent (or he didn't want it as bad as he thought he did).
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Wade's Avatar
Canada
2781 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  1:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Wade to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
dont do it. if the item is important to him he will find another way (postal money order?)

anytime someone is rushing and pointing out that they expect you to be honest.... RED FLAGS

dont send anything you cant afford to loose
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Coin Chick's Avatar
Canada
1354 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  2:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coin Chick to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Ask him to pay as a family/friend through PayPal. Then there is no fee and he cannot come back at you. He will have to trust you 100% though.
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coinmancanada's Avatar
Canada
4 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  3:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coinmancanada to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I thought the 2.9% still applied to family. At any rate, I suggested he pay the extra amount to cover the fee and he agreed to that no problem. (red flag) his response was a word for word duplicate of the above quote again with the new amount (red flag), but no other questions answered about his location, ship/no ship, etc. (rf again)

I've pretty much decided I'm not going to sell to him unless he can do cash. Any great ideas on how to test if they are for real? Supply a phoney PayPal address and see if I get a fake email?
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BadThad's Avatar
United States
19942 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  3:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BadThad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Ask him to pay as a family/friend through PayPal. Then there is no fee and he cannot come back at you. He will have to trust you 100% though.


This is true, I didn't think of that. There's NO FEE for a gift payment and the buyer would be on his own, paypal doesn't guarantee anything for the buyer when paid as a gift.

The only thing to worry about is if the paypal account has been hijacked and this guy is looking for a quick conversion. You could have the money taken from your account!
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westernsky's Avatar
United States
7617 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  4:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add westernsky to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The whole mess is stinking more and more. Run Forest, run!
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matttheriley's Avatar
United States
1512 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  5:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add matttheriley to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree, don't do it.
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edweather's Avatar
United States
7375 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  5:44 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add edweather to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Trust your gut, if it walks and talks like a duck........
Pillar of the Community
United States
836 Posts
 Posted 10/20/2014  7:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add brenpickle to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you have doubt then don't do it. I always go with my gut.
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Left's Avatar
United States
240 Posts
 Posted 10/21/2014  12:31 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Left to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
After over $500 in chargebacks this is all I have to say........ http://www.paypalsucks.com/
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BH1964's Avatar
United States
10982 Posts
 Posted 10/21/2014  01:01 am  Show Profile   Check BH1964's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add BH1964 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's up to you of course but if a buyer wants to pay with PayPal I have no problem with it unless there is some other huge red flag. PayPal shipping rules will specify you ship with an approved service and use signature confirmation. If you do and then remove the money from your PayPal account you should be fine. Again, make sure it is cleared payment for "goods and services" and ships to the PayPal address specified.

Now if the buyer is really pushy and/or suspicious then just move along.
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