Counterfeit Coins Cause For Concern Among Canadian Collectors

i have mentioned this before that what happens once these fake coins become exact replicas? I mean why cant a coin be made exactly the same as one made in 1912? our technology has gotten to that point, use exact alloys and exact pattern leaving no tell tale markers and put in a professional looking slab,,,, now what? we are screwed! we need to make much harsher penalties and stop all exports out of china

@inconnu: Working metal and plastic are two different skillsets.

@gidjit: Potentially one could, only problem is one has to find a diemaker with corrupt ethics. It's a dying artform along with engraving and repoussee, but even repoussee is being mass-manufactured now in China which is pretty alarming. Diemaking is something I would love to learn, but like with any other artform you need a master to teach you, and most of these people are retired or not willing to teach. One could potentially CNC mill a die, but still you need more skills to polish the die, harden it, make hubs and more dies; it's still a lengthy enough process - it's not like printing paper money.

I have enjoyed coin collecting for over 50yrs. I think about selling all my stuff just because of the Fakes are going to ruin it for us.

I remember when(60`s) I almost bought a 1877 Indian Head cent. It was marked as a replica, stamped on the reverse as one. But you knew it. I really wanted to fill that empty hole, but wanted the real one. Now no marking about anything except for the experts in the business to keep track of them.

I enjoy this CCF forum as I believe that your followers have the same feelings as I do and I have learned a lot that I never knew until I joined.

I have enjoyed reading and following this thread on how this is such a concern for our hobby. It really made me think how serious this could effect the hobby.
I have been a coin collector for over 40 yrs. and the majority of my collection would have been purchased in the early 80's to 1995. When I started there were no TPG's and all coins were raw. This is why over the last couple years I have been sending many of my coins to ICCS for certification.
I really enjoyed coin collecting but was looking at it as both a hobby and a investment as I was trying to purchase high grade and key date coins hoping to have fun but also possibly see it's value increase over time.
Back then there were almost no counterfeit coins to speak of. I can even remember going to coin shows and someone there would have a counterfeit coin and everyone would look it over and have a good laugh because they were so poorly done that they couldn't fool anyone. How times have changed.
So I have to ask myself, if I was in the same position today as I was 40 yrs ago. When I could invest or buy whatever coins I wanted without the worry of a counterfeit, would I have bought any coins because I saw it as both a hobby and a investment.
This problem could make young collectors/investors reluctant to get involved in this hobby because of counterfeits.

TPG companies can guarantee coins are not counterfeit but unless they are out of the slabs or baggies for verification by another TPGCVC "CVC" for counterfeit/verification/company and another stamp on top of that by another TPG specializing in making sure they are okay and another company that will send us some pills to soothe the ulcers from all the extra worry, it may just work out.

3D printing... I wouldn't worry about that. The technology is still very expensive and primitive. I get to see 3D printed objects all day long and if they could print out silver or gold they would instead of casting them. It's not viable ($$$) or reliable yet. Wax, resin, and plastic are expensive for those machines, let alone synthetic gold.

Interesting , looks like a quality product such as a coin is a long way off.

Still has to be made of real gold or silver to fool the XRF machines - and in the correct exact alloy. People don't understand alloys too much, because there are some that are made for rolling and fabricating, and other alloys that favor casting. A synthetic alloy for 3D printing won't cut it because their one standardized alloy will be favorable for "growing" and it won't be polished! The patterns made by a CNC machine leave much to be desired. Good detail takes a long long time, around 26 hours for simple objects and still you have tool marks that have to be polished down. It's not viable yet. Coins are pressed and because of that it is still cheaper to make a die. Pressed means the metal is hard and polished. Your cartwheel luster is part of that. CCF will keep counterfeiters scratching their heads as long as we're educating each other on this forum. And we need appraisal houses in big cities that surpass slabbers' abilities. If we can spot coins that are cleaned, polished, mint state, etc, we have nothing to worry about, especially cartwheel luster which only comes from dies - it can't be programmed into a machine and they would still have to make the die to duplicate the effect. Even making the die from a 3D printer wouldn't work yet for the same reasons. Making a gun that goes bang is one thing but making a coin that will be scrutinized by educated fellows like us is quite another.

Edit: I just thought of this: Instead of making rare coins, why wouldn't a counterfeiter just make wads of $100 bills to 3D print? Makes more sense to me!