Coin Community Family of Web Sites Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors
Royal Estate Auctions - $1 Coin Auctions300,000 items to help build your collection! Royal Canadian Mint products, Canadian, Polish, American, and world coins and banknotes. Vancouvers #1 Coin and Paper Money Dealer Coin, Banknote and Medal Collectors's Online Mall Join Thousands of Coin, Bullion, & Money Collectors Specializing in Modern Numismatics








Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.

Welcome Guest! Registering and/or logging in will remove the anchor (bottom) ads. It's Free!

1787 Vermont "Britannia" Copper Submitted For Grading - This One Is Tricky

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 13 / Views: 1,912Next Topic  
Pillar of the Community
billjones's Avatar
United States
1499 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  3:02 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add billjones to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
1787-Vermont-
1787-Vermont-

The first Vermont coppers were struck by Reuben Harmon, Jr. of Rupert, Vermont. Later production was moved to Machin's Mills in New York State. Machin's Mills has long fascinated collectors who are drawn to colonial and Confederation era coinage. The facility made legitimate coins during the day and often turned its attentions to counterfeit coins at night. Strange sounds were known to emanate from the place at night to scare away curious boys and others who might have been drawn to see what was going there after dark.

At any rate, have fun grading this. I'll be back tomorrow or the next day to continue the story.
Pillar of the Community
Slider23's Avatar
United States
4469 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  3:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Slider23 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
AU58
Rest in Peace
bpoc1's Avatar
United States
4078 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  3:54 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bpoc1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Wow! Looking at "Grading Guide for Early American Copper Coins", this should tell you I know nothing but, learning every day.
The Obverse AU.
The Reverse VF
So is this book reference for an EAC grade?
EAC grade EF.
Rest in Peace
bpoc1's Avatar
United States
4078 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  4:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bpoc1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Billjones, CCF member/moderator Vermontensium ,(Dave) will love this coin.
Thanks for posting.
Pillar of the Community
chequer's Avatar
Canada
4227 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  5:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chequer to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
AU50
Pillar of the Community
Jaobler's Avatar
United States
6396 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  5:41 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jaobler to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The obverse looks close to mint state so I will presume the reverse weakness is "as struck". PCGS AU-58 seems plausible. Very nice and exotic coin!
Pillar of the Community
United States
3164 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  5:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jerryc39 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
also thinking higher Au grade
Pillar of the Community
TJsCoins's Avatar
United States
3229 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  6:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TJsCoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very nice colonial!!
I think the TPG gave it a AU 55. The obverse I would gine a 58. I see wear on the reverse so will give it a 55.
Bedrock of the Community
paralyse's Avatar
United States
12057 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  10:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add paralyse to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Beautiful. Not even going to attempt a grade.

I prefer the VERMONTS. / VERMONTIS & VERMONTENSIUM designs, but I own one of these in much rougher condition.
Member ANA - EAC - TNA - SSDC - CCT #890

"Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossible before they were done." -- Louis D. Brandeis
Bedrock of the Community
Learn More...
panzaldi's Avatar
United States
18706 Posts
 Posted 03/17/2016  11:08 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add panzaldi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Really cool coin and interesting story. AU55
Pillar of the Community
billjones's Avatar
United States
1499 Posts
 Posted 03/18/2016  09:35 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add billjones to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This coin currently resides in a PCGS EF-45 holder. It was sold in an NGC AU-50 when Heritage auctioned off the Newman collection in several parts. I think that it really is an AU coin.

This piece can only be graded from obverse unless you are an expert in grading by surfaces. The reverse was also paired with one of Machin's Mills' counterfeit British half pennies. It was intentionally made to look the way it does to convince people to accept it. If a coin looked well worn, that was evidence that many other people had accepted it as good piece of money. In other words the reverse pretty much looked like this the day it was minted.

The Newman coin envelope also came with this piece. It is interesting to note that this piece was first marked as a Machin's Mills counterfeit British half penny. That attribution was then crossed out, and the Vermont attribution was written in to replace it.

Here is a "real" Machin's Mills counterfeit British half penny.

1787-Vermont-
1787-Vermont-
Edited by billjones
03/18/2016 09:38 am
Pillar of the Community
Joe2007's Avatar
United States
3843 Posts
 Posted 03/18/2016  6:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Joe2007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Neat! Thank you for these informative posts.
Bedrock of the Community
IndianGoldEagle's Avatar
United States
36878 Posts
 Posted 03/18/2016  10:01 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add IndianGoldEagle to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
EF-45
Bedrock of the Community
Learn More...
panzaldi's Avatar
United States
18706 Posts
 Posted 03/18/2016  10:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add panzaldi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The stories about these coins are great. Thanks Bill
  Previous TopicReplies: 13 / Views: 1,912Next Topic  

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



    




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2026 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.36 seconds to rattle this change. Forums