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 Replies: 49 / Views: 7,311 |
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Valued Member
Canada
118 Posts |
I have had a similar experience as a buyer on ebay, and been shafted a couple of times as a seller as well (for different merchandise than coins). It feels bad from both sides. In similar cases, the responses on this board are pretty representative of the responses in this case. The coin is substantially different from what was pictured. There is a chorus of "it's the same value, get a life you terrible buyer." There is also a chorus of "you should be able to return it without being accused of switching out coins." I stand more on the latter side, than the former. I would keep in mind for sellers who post a lot of coins and use a scanner to expedite making listings, the odd one will slip through like this. What made this hard for the buyer was the accusation of switching coins (which probably has happened to the seller - I've heard of cases like that in other collectibles like redline hot wheels). Either way, ebay will settle it. The buyer has the opportunity to add to feedback when the deal is settled, if he/she so chooses, although it's rare ebay will permit feedback to be deleted entirely. Personally, I would change the feedback once everything is settled, were I the buyer. As always, some members here side with the seller immediately. Perhaps they sell more than they buy. I am more on the buyer side, but then I buy more than I sell. |
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
737 Posts |
He messaged me multiple accusations and I remained calm for a while. I think I did give him the benefit of the doubt from the beginning until he started making accusations towards me. I have never left negative FB, I don't like it & I think it's bad for business all around but this guy... Beside, I can ask ebay to remove it anytime and I know that. I was just biting back strategically. This was the exchange: I rec'd my coin today and there is a deep gouge on the coin that is not shown in the photos at all. I can't see either why the small scratches show up and this big one didn't... Please get back to me, Thanks, Ken coinshop2006: Hello - This is not the coin we sent - our coin shows no rim damage, your picture does Me: This is Exactly the coin you sent, don't play games with me & my money. You just called me a liar!! coinshop2006: Your picture does not match the picture we have on file - sorry... Me: It matches exactly. I just took high res photos and super-imposed the 2 coins and they are a perfect match. I will be returning this coin for a FULL refund + Return registered shipping $15 you will be paying for. I am sending you another photo that you might want to look at and will be sending the same one to ebay to let their coin department look at it. And yes, the do have specialist's reserved to look at counterfeit coins or seller's who may be doctoring their photos. I am not accusing you of this because like I said before, it may be the scanner. Please look carefully at the images I am sending and tell me what you see yourself. UP TO NOW, I WAS PRETTY PATIENT I THINK, UNTIL THIS.. coinshop: Do not send anything back till we let ebay make a decision - I am reporting you as a seller trying to defraud me by replacing a coin. Me: Even the Reverse (dated side) is identical. How dare you accuse me of switching coins. You're a disgrace to ebay & give other sellers a bad rep ! Go sell on Etsy or something & leave ebay to the Pro's. coinshop2006: How dare YOU try to pawn of one your lesser coins just to get back your twenty bucks - you are a disgrace to all the fine buyers we have on ebay - leave ebay at once and let us HONEST people trade in a fair manner. It was at this point, after the last comment that he got the Neg FB. After it's resolved, I will consider removing it or reducing it to a Neutrol but a Seller like that needs a lesson. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1581 Posts |
> I blew up the photo of that area, and I don't really see obvious any evidence of Photoshopping (unless he is really good).
Isn't "Photoshop" a catch-all term to mean: Manipulated the original photo or scan?
Even adjusting the brightness and contrast qualifies. And, I expect it happens all the time. Why would someone post bad scans if a little tweaking can be more representative of the coin in-hand?
There are times when very high quality scans emphasize the flaws that are difficult to see in-hand. Full disclosure would list the flaws, and perhaps provide both scans.
It seems both parties show a history of trustworthiness. It is a darn shame this has escalated so quickly.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
737 Posts |
Loll, I admit I felt like the fish that got caught by the worm. His accusations were from the beginning and continued throughout the exchange & I lost it a little. I am normally very polite and don't resort to these tactics. I'm not trying to slander anyone but if he has had exactly the same issue with another buyer & has done the same thing, ebay will have it on record and he will get a warning or worse. If he is doing this to me, I figure he's done it or will do it again because if you read his very first reply, it was MY fault and he was accepting Zero responsibility, so he obviously thinks he's above reproach & that didn't sit well with me. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
737 Posts |
I was able to pick it up better when holding the coin on an angle because of the light reflection. But as you can see in my overhead shot, like his scans, it doesn't always show up. I wouldn't go through all this for a $30 coin believe me. What a way to ruin your night.
Edited by TaeKenDo
06/18/2016 3:01 pm
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Valued Member
United States
259 Posts |
Definitely the same coin and as a seller seeing the scratch in hand, there is no excuse for not trying to capture the scratch in the photos or not mentioning it in the description. Keep in mind- when looking at the first photo you took when you received the coin, the scratch isn't visible! So it's easy to unintentionally photograph that coin without the scratch.
Still, his response in emails shows he didn't want the coin back which to me implies he knew from the beginning he was less than transparent in the description.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
737 Posts |
The shipping envelop also arrived intact, so no damage occurred along the way. It was done before it left & either he didn't see it or ignored it figuring I'd suck it up as a buyer.
Edited by TaeKenDo
06/18/2016 9:11 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
737 Posts |
I don't even want to go there with what he knew or didn't know or anything like that. I usually don't make things personal...not until the other person does and then only in defense by going on the offensive if necessary. It's just business. He's trying to sell & make a profit and I'm trying to buy & make a collection and sell a few on the side myself. But if a buyer tells me there's a problem with my coin, I don't accuse him offhand by implying that he switched out the coins telling him it's not the coin I sent when it very well could be. These things happen so no biggie but that's not the way he came back at me with my first message. That's when I buckled my seat belt...loll
Edited by TaeKenDo
06/18/2016 3:12 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2403 Posts |
I'm sorry this has happened to you. Having said that, I do see that you have editing software yourself and seem to be able to use it efficiently. Next time try running sellers pics through whatever software you use 1st. If you had done this in 1st place headache could've been avoided on both ends.
While the seller should only be able to adjust lighting problems in editing(I know they do more), the buyer can and should always run sellers pics through their own software to get a better look at coin. This can be done with Photoshop or several other free photo editors. This does 2 things, it gives you more confidence in what your are buying and it also gives you a reference copy big enough to compare to to make sure there wasn't switch done by the seller.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
737 Posts |
Thanks, yeah that's good advice as an afterthought. To me it looked pretty straightforward. I could see the obvious marks so I never expected a bigger scratch would not show up if the smaller ones did. Live and learn.
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Valued Member
Canada
118 Posts |
I respectfully disagree with having to run auction photos through editing software. The seller should be posting accurate photos and describing an accurate representation of the coin (or any product).
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2403 Posts |
Quote:
The seller should be posting accurate photos and describing an accurate representation of the coin (or any product). I agree with this...and in a perfect world this would be the way it would run. Unfortunately there are A LOT of people on ebay looking to make a quick buck and even more with poor camera skills or lighting. By running Seller pics through my own software, I have reduced the number(now 0) of undescribed cleaned coins that I have purchased. These can be hard to see for me without blowing up to see the fine scratches. This is the main reason I do it. Edit: I have also gotten some great deals from the bay by doing this to coin pics from sellers with really bad pic skills. Ones that the pic kept the bidding low not the actual condition of the coin. These usually occur on people just selling inherited coins, or antique stores selling on ebay. Edited by MontCollector
06/18/2016 5:54 pm
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5395 Posts |
Read this thread with particular interest, due to the fact that I know the seller quite well. We have enjoyed doing many deals with each other over the years. He is an absolute first class guy. To leave a negative over this is not cool. The OP is a seller as well, and as they say Karma will bite. I will just say this , the pictures looked ok and for what was paid for this coin (20 USD) there really is not much of an issue.It will easily bring more at a coin show or collectibles market. Selling on ebay these days is a tough business due to the fact that every thing is eventually solved in the buyers favour. Knowing that, we have a no questions14 day return policy and keep it friendly at all costs. Unwarranted negatives can kill an ebay business. The only positive tool a seller has is the blocked bidder buyer list . Too bad the described situation got so bent out of shape on both  sides. Edited by Pacificoin
06/18/2016 5:40 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1463 Posts |
I'm with pacific both parties got to throw pride out the window and make it right. Such a simple misunderstanding, but I do understand the ebay environment tends to turn people into passive aggressive kooks sometimes. Good place to start is offer to get that feedback down. Things will go smoothly from there. |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
737 Posts |
Well Pacific, you may have had great experiences with the dealer but my first one was one where his First Class rating went out the window from the get go and that on a new buyer. Maybe he had a bad day and that's ok but you have to put those things aside as much as possible. Maybe he's had bad experiences as a seller, but I have too as well as a buyer. As for being picky as one commented above, I'm not sure it's too much to ask to get your money's worth. After all, the buyer is at a disadvantage because unlike coin stores & shows, he doesn't have the coin in hand to examen it therefore relies on the sellers honesty and being forthcoming. But if something happens, for sure doesn't expect to be treated as & liar & a thief by the person you gave your money to and sent you other than what you paid for. I did some investigating after ebay sent us mutual contact info. I'm not sure if it's his place but I found a news article from a google search about an employee at the Vancouver coin shop being shot & killed in a robbery. Maybe there's some residue left over from that if it's the same place. Wish I had have read it before leaving the feedback but even before losing it in my responses to his messages. I should have kept my cool. Edited by TaeKenDo
06/19/2016 12:52 am
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Replies: 49 / Views: 7,311 |
First Page
Posted 06/18/2016 2:45 pm
