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14 Arches Quarter Missing E In We And T In Trust. New Error?

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DonjMcK's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2016  06:17 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add DonjMcK to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
14-Arches-Quarter-Missing-E-In-We-And-T-In-Trust.-New-Error?

14-Arches-Quarter-Missing-E-In-We-And-T-In-Trust.-New-Error?

14-Arches-Quarter-Missing-E-In-We-And-T-In-Trust.-New-Error?

*** Moved by Staff to a more appropriate forum. ***
Edited by DonjMcK
07/17/2016 06:23 am
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NoPoMoCo's Avatar
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403 Posts
 Posted 07/17/2016  08:09 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add NoPoMoCo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Surprising to me. While it looks like a Struck Through Grease error, I had thought this problem was solved by the monomolecular lubrication procedure for clad coinage now implemented at the mints http://federalnewsradio.com/technol...the-us-mint/. Still probably struck through, but the question is struck through what if grease is no longer used.
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Conder101's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2016  10:12 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well there is probably more than one lubricant involved. The dies are lubed, the press is lubed, the planchts are lubricated So the planchets are continously bringing more oils into the coining chanber. Sure most of it leaves again withthe finished coin but you could still get a build up of "grease"

One thing I find odd in that report is the die life of 150 - 200 K. That a fair die life, for the 1850's, 1870's. Die life for dimes in 2006 was roughly four times that. So are they now getting 1.2 to 1.6 million coins per die pair?
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CelticKnot's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2016  12:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CelticKnot to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


Any possibility to get a more clear shot of the area in question?
Edited by CelticKnot
07/17/2016 12:40 pm
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Coinfrog's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2016  5:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yes, sharp close-ups would be great.



to the CCF!
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DonjMcK's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2016  6:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DonjMcK to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thank guys. I have a microscope coming for better photographs on close up pictures. I'm currently using a magnifying glass but am taking the photographs in 1280 x 800. When cropping and reducing the image to under 300K be it is very degrading the quality do you have any suggestions on how to keep the file under the 300 KB workout sacrificing image quality?
I apologize I am new to playing collecting and don't understand all of the abbreviated acronyms like "DD". I do believe there is a very fancy and even century but I would consider it a Light Strike I guess. Just wouldn't think it would be the last two letters would think it would Encompass the whole In God We Trust. Also if they're slightly off-center. I will repost on my microscope shows up also the impossible over date on Lincoln 2006 / 7. I know that they don't over date this late in the series but it sure looks like one. I will get back to all of you look better images. Thanks again.
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CelticKnot's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2016  9:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CelticKnot to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There's an image optimizer you can use when uploading photos that will reduce the file size while not sacrificing any quality (for the purposes of web browsing). Read about it here in the FAQ section..
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NoPoMoCo's Avatar
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 Posted 07/18/2016  09:09 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add NoPoMoCo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@Condor101: Thanks. The picture I always had in my mind of the cause of a " Greaser" was of a mint employee too liberally applying lubricant to a dieface with crusty material getting into the incuse devices. Taking the human out of the equation by having just enough lubricant for a single strike on the planchet seemed brilliant. Greasers would be no more! I hadn't considered that other moving parts such as the collar also need lubrication... "grease will find a way." The new process extends the die life considerably (2 to 3 times according to the documentation) thereby saving federal$, but fortunately for us coin errors are still going to happen as die wear progresses. 100K-200K strikes before the switch seemed okay to me for the less malleable clad coinage. PCGS put the mintage of the 1982 no P dime at 75K http://www.PCGS.com/news/the-1982-n...osevelt-dime but I don't know where they get their numbers. Die pairs on malleable silver and copper will go much further.
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DonjMcK's Avatar
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 Posted 08/24/2016  03:55 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DonjMcK to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
here are the new pictures I promised. Hope these are clear enough. I also noticed some doubling in the letters IN GOD W,R,U and S? Is it md?

14-Arches-Quarter-Missing-E-In-We-And-T-In-Trust.-New-Error?

14-Arches-Quarter-Missing-E-In-We-And-T-In-Trust.-New-Error?

14-Arches-Quarter-Missing-E-In-We-And-T-In-Trust.-New-Error?
Edited by DonjMcK
08/24/2016 03:58 am
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coop's Avatar
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 Posted 08/24/2016  07:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The die is getting into the later die state by looking at the Die Deterioration along the right side of the devices on the motto. There are several contact marks in that area, but there is evidence of part of those devices. So I feel it was grease/oil/water that prevented those devices from striking up. Fairly common on the design for the quarters. But you made a fine improvement on your image skills. Improvement in always nice to see. You didn't give up. Some do.
Edited by coop
08/24/2016 07:33 am
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sonchild's Avatar
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 Posted 08/24/2016  12:52 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sonchild to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks like a Greaser, nice find.
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Conder101's Avatar
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 Posted 08/24/2016  1:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
PCGS put the mintage of the 1982 no P dime at 75K http://www.PCGS.com/news/the-1982-n...osevelt-dime but I don't know where they get their numbers.

In that case mintage and die life are probably not the same. The pressmen inspect coins being produced at regular intervals and once they noticed the missing mintmark the die was probably pulled early. Mintage estimates can be made from how frequently they are found and or submitted and by studying the amount of die wear between the earliest die states seen and the latest. Average die life for dimes by 1982 was close to 500K not 75K so the die was most certainly discovered and pulled early. (75K would still represent nearly a full shift's production.)
Pillar of the Community
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 Posted 08/24/2016  7:41 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add 11997755 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Agree, a Greaser. I have one that is similar but missing a few more letters.

14-Arches-Quarter-Missing-E-In-We-And-T-In-Trust.-New-Error?

14-Arches-Quarter-Missing-E-In-We-And-T-In-Trust.-New-Error?

14-Arches-Quarter-Missing-E-In-We-And-T-In-Trust.-New-Error?
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DonjMcK's Avatar
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 Posted 08/25/2016  8:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DonjMcK to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the confirmation on the Greaser. It shall be put up then let's hope they pulled that die or cleaned it not long after so it's more on the rare side. 11997755 looks like they might of run longer than I was hoping. I guess only time will tell.
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