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 Replies: 29 / Views: 8,411 |
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Valued Member
 Bulgaria
53 Posts |
@BH1964
But is there existing a table ( if possible with correspondences with MS) showing all these un-MS grades?
Edited by kaji
08/30/2016 1:33 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1603 Posts |
I still had trouble getting that second one verified. Two out of three times it comes back as invalid and then in gives info. That's just plain strange to me. Maybe the new 89-code means, the Chinese government paid a premium to have 10,000 colorized "coins" sonically sealed without looking very closely at their quality. ?    ? I give up. edit: @kaji: No, there really isn't. The examples from coin talk are about the best (and generally accepted) correlation that you'll find. Edited by Biedercoins
08/30/2016 1:37 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12437 Posts |
As BH1964 mentioned, the "Gem BU" designation is occasionally used for bulk submissions. Coins slabbed as such are frequently used as promotional items. Quote:
PR70 is a higher grade than MS70 Not true, they are on two separate grading scales. PR is strictly for proof strikes while MS is strictly for business strikes. Quote:
And what about Prooflike? That one is a bit more confusing. PL can refer to a strike type, similar to Specimen. These coins are minted more carefully than an ordinary business strike but do not receive the full proof treatment(specially prepared blanks and dies, struck more than once at high pressure, white glove handling). PL can also refer to an exceptional business strike with some proof qualities, i.e. a coin sharply struck with fresh dies. |
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Valued Member
Bulgaria
53 Posts |
@biokemist6
If you remove a PR70 from its holder and you give it to PCGS, they will grade it at 100% MINIMUM as a MS70.
But the opposite is not true; a MS 70 will never be classified as a PR70 !
But the question is: WHY PCGS (and NGC) are giving grades different that those ones from the Sheldon's scale?
@Biedercoin
The Chinese Government DOES NOT SELL graded coins !
Edited by kaji
08/30/2016 2:17 pm
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10982 Posts |
Quote:
@BH1964
But is there existing a table ( if possible with correspondences with MS) showing all these un-MS grades? Not really but the following are usually accepted: MS60/better: BU MS63/better: Choice BU MS65/better: Gem BU MS67/better: Superb Gem BU. As always YMMV. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
12437 Posts |
Quote:
If you remove a PR70 from its holder and you give it to PCGS, they will grade it at 100% MINIMUM as a MS70. Not true, PR and MS are most definitely not interchangeable. Proof and Uncirculated/Mint State refer to the type of minting process, not the grade itself, there should never be any confusion between the two in regards to modern coinage. A proof coin will always be a proof coin with a proof grade, even if it has received wear or impairment. An uncirculated/MS coin becomes a circulated coin when it is worn but it will still always be a business strike. |
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Moderator
 United States
34439 Posts |
 with biokemist6 on this one. While the same 1-70 scale is appropriate for both proof coins and those intended for circulation, those two types of coins are manufactured in distinct ways. Apples and oranges. "If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1119 Posts |
Quote:
If you remove a PR70 from its holder and you give it to PCGS, they will grade it at 100% MINIMUM as a MS70.
But the opposite is not true; a MS 70 will never be classified as a PR70 ! not true it could get a lesser proof grade though  |
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Valued Member
United States
314 Posts |
PCGS seems to be an organization that is very careful with its standards and reputation. I'm not sure it moves them in the right direction to slab a bunch of coins to sell to people on CVS for the benefit of China. If it took the experienced people on this board two pages of discussion to clarify the original question, that is clearly a failure of their business model, or am I missing something?
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Valued Member
Bulgaria
53 Posts |
@Centsei
That's just what I want to know!
PCGS and NGC are they doing OFFICIALLY these certifications without MS?
Or is it done without PCGS or NGC responsability ? And then these kinds of "grading" have " no value".
Therefore, the main question is : the slabs as shown in my 1st message, are they covered by the guarantee of PCGS?
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10982 Posts |
Quote:
Therefore, the main question is : the slabs as shown in my 1st message, are they covered by the guarantee of PCGS? These coins are not graded per se so the guarantee is that they are genuine. When modern coins straight from the mint(s) are slabbed, slapping a Gem BU label on them has virtually no risk since they should never grade below that level. |
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Moderator
United States
54283 Posts |
Quote:Quote:
If you remove a PR70 from its holder and you give it to PCGS, they will grade it at 100% MINIMUM as a MS70.
But the opposite is not true; a MS 70 will never be classified as a PR70 ! not true it could get a lesser proof grade though (picture of PR55 Morgan dollar - omitted) The scenario was a cracked-out PR70 given to PCGS. PCGS would not grade a PR70 as a PR55. Your example was of a proof Morgan that got circulated. Not quite the same scenario. I agree that if the grading company has any expertise at all, they would never give a proof coin a MS grade. Show your financial support of the Coin Community Family (click here)See my topic on Mexican Numismatic Medals (click here) |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7390 Posts |
Boy this thread is a mountain from a molehill. Bottom line is that the op gem slab is a bulk no-grade slab.
And
PF/PR refer to grading a proof coin while MS is for business strikes and more recently SP for specimen coins there can, by definition, be no interchangeablity.
As a few others have said before.
As to why the 89 code is not on the PCGS list I'm not sure but a simple call to their CS should answer that.
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Valued Member
United States
294 Posts |
Personally, I wouldn't want either of these coins; so boring.
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Replies: 29 / Views: 8,411 |
First Page
Posted 08/30/2016 1:30 pm
