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Bullion Vs Numismatic Value

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 Posted 02/18/2017  6:34 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Hunter611 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hey folks I have a question regarding bullion vs numismatic value. For Morgans when/how do you value the coin as bullion vs numismatic value e.g. do all G4 and above have numismatic value worth the the premium barring key date coins? Thanks in advance.
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Debrajc's Avatar
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 Posted 02/18/2017  6:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Debrajc to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Very common Morgans in G4 condition can be purchased at a slight premium.

For example if silver is $18 an oz. I have seen common date worn Morgan / Peace dollars in the $21 - $22 range retail.

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 Posted 02/18/2017  7:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Hunter611 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So is there a price point when you basically say the small premium (several dollars or so) isn't worth the cost associated with selling e.g. ebay, craigs list etc.. vs just selling at bullion price?
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 Posted 02/18/2017  8:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Druu to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have yet to find silver dollars at bullion prices, and I've been looking for a pocket piece. My local stores have junk Morgan/Peace dollars at $20 (a few weeks ago) and $25 at a different store two days ago. The two stores had junk silver at $2 over spot and 18x face, respectively.
Edited by Druu
02/18/2017 8:14 pm
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 Posted 02/18/2017  9:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add terry8835 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Of course if you as a private seller go to your LCS and want to sell common Morgans in good condition you probably will get their bullion value since the LCS owner or the dealer has to make some profit. For you to really make a decent profit on a silver or gold coin either you have to hold them a long time or the price of the metal has to really increase unless you have your own ebay store. If silver bullion price goes from $18 an ounce to make decent money the price probably has to go up 25% for you to make money given transaction costs. This is just my opinion. This is why I think of precious metals as insurance rather than an investment. Consider that your bullion pays no dividends or interest and you usually have to pay to store it. I see where major investment gurus say PM's have no place in modern investment portfolio, but I can see that just as an insurance policy against hyperinflation or economic disaster I would like some gold and silver and plenty of guns and ammo to defend it. Send lawyers, guns and money, but you need money to get the other two. If you could buy silver eagles for a couple of bucks over spot and the price of silver went up 800% due to some disaster then it would be good to have those silver or gold coins in your safe. Before the disaster buy the AR-15 or AK47 and lots of ammo because you will probably need it. Have maximum protected FDIC in a few bank accounts as well and some 30 year bonds. Now I sound like survivalist. I have been watching too many of these "end of the world" movies like "The Way We Live Now". That one really got to me. Have you noticed that the general view of America is that if we had huge disaster every one would revert to dog eat dog and all civilized behavior would go out the window in two weeks?
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 Posted 02/18/2017  9:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Crazyb0 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I got these 3 for a total Of $63.75 all total online auction about best I've been able to do


Bullion-Vs-Numismatic-Value

Druu, about same here, but LCS apparently doesn't consider me a prime customer...always doesn't seem to have any when I show up.

Edited by Crazyb0
02/18/2017 9:20 pm
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 Posted 02/18/2017  11:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Druu to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Crazy, let me know if you want me to pick some up for you at the $20 place. (I'll have to call them tomorrow since silver was a touch lower last time.) It gives me an excuse to lay all of them out on the counter and snap a picture so I can get home and look for desirable dates since I don't know jack about Morgans/Peace dollars. "Of course, sir. I'm taking a picture for a friend who's looking to fill holes in an album."

The second place had a slabbed details coin in the same area as his junk. I didn't ask for price on that specific coin, but I was tempted -- it was an 1880-O ANACS MS60 details that had been polished to heck. I wasn't sure I could even make it look good if I turned it into a pocket piece so I let it be. Did I miss a good deal? PCGS price guide suggests yes, but ebay sold listings suggests no.
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 Posted 02/19/2017  12:41 am  Show Profile   Check spru's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add spru to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
PCGS price guide suggests yes, but ebay sold listings suggests no.


Then no.
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 Posted 02/19/2017  03:07 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jaobler to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Morgan and Peace dollars will almost always sell for a premium over bullion value. Keep in mind that these coins start out with about 0.77 ounces of silver content so at a silver spot price of $18 the bullion value is only (0.77)x($18) = $13.86. Worn coins contain even less silver. Nevertheless, you probably won't find any for less than maybe $20 unless they are really mutilated.
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 Posted 02/19/2017  1:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add terry8835 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Jaobler

Seeing it that way even common and well worn Morgan and Peace dollars are a bargain. If you buy them at $20 you may have to wait quite a while to sell them at a profit. The thing to me is between buying, holding and selling the collector usually gets squeezed. The whole thing boils down to why you are buying these coins? If you are just buying them as junk silver you are overpaying. If you are buying them with hopes that one day their numismatic value will rise then why not buy coins in better condition? If your are buying junk silver would you not be better off buying silver Roosevelt dimes, Washington quarters and Franklin half dollars which are 90% silver but do not have the premium that silver dollars have on them. I notice all the silver coins of the 20th century do have a premium on them what for those collecting them as bullion where is the best value?
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 Posted 02/19/2017  6:16 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Hunter611 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Terry, your last sentence is a good question, one that I ponder as well.
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 Posted 02/19/2017  6:57 pm  Show Profile   Check nss-52's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add nss-52 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
0.77 oz for $20 equates to $25.97 per ounce of silver. At $20 for a Morgan, you are getting about $13.90 in silver at today's closing price. When silver per ounce rises to $25.97 then your Morgan dollar will be worth $20.

However, at that point, you won't be able to buy a Morgan silver dollar for $20. You will probably have to pay $26 or more to get one. Morgan dollars are so popular that they do not generally trade for bullion value.

Regarding ebay prices:
Almost all the Morgan dollars on ebay that have sold for under $15 are one of the following:
1) Counterfeit
2) "Two Faced" novelty
3) Error by seller when setting price for Buy It Now
4) The listing started at 99¢ and for some reason (perhaps the coin looks counterfeit) only one bidder put in a bid and the listing ended at 99¢
5) Extremely worn or damaged or both

It should be noted that there are a LOT of counterfeit Morgan dollars listed on ebay, and unfortunately a lot of them sell. You can not rely on ebay sold prices to determine the true market value for Morgan dollars.
Edited by nss-52
02/19/2017 7:09 pm
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