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 Replies: 14 / Views: 5,348 |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1949 Posts |
  I have found the history behind the coinage of the Lodz Ghetto to be some of the most interesting in world coinage The 20 Mark, nicknamed the 'Ghetto Crown', is one of the scarcest pieces with only 600 minted. As such a rare piece, it is highly counterfeited. This is a piece that unless you are very knowledgeable with the type, is better to buy certified. Earlier this summer, I saw a documentary on the history of Lodz, and after watching it, to imagine that anything survived this dark period of humanity is quite amazing. BJ Searls of PCGS has a nice article on the Lodz coinage I have linked below, it is a quick and informative piece: https://www.PCGS.com/news/lodz-ghet...ken-coinage/Feel free to comment on my 20 Mark piece or to guess the grade!
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Pillar of the Community
Norway
1358 Posts |
First of all, that's one nice coin. If you ask me to grade it, I'd say VF, as it's still in very good condition, but has some wear on the stars on the obverse and the T on the reverse.
If it sounds surprising that things survived from that period, then I kindly ask you to come and join us in Europe for a few weeks and have a look in some of the sites of World War II. You'll see that surprisingly much has survived of the ghettos and even of the concentration and destruction camps. In fact, a little too much has survived according to the Nazi's, despite serious attempts to destroy every nook and cranny in for example Auschwitz, when the war was almost lost and the Soviets were just days away. If you look in the museum over there, you'll see heaps of items that survived. So I'm not surprised that ghetto coinage did so, too... I'm more surprised that it's still in this good condition, actually.
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Rest in Peace
United States
17900 Posts |
When I was hunting world coins, this remained near the top of my want list for over a decade.
I never found one that wasn't a poor counterfeit.
Congratulations on capturing one of these scarce pieces.
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Valued Member
United States
414 Posts |
This one is on my to acquire list; I had a chance to bid on one graded AU55 and missed it. The coin sold for a bit above 1000 I think or something in the area which I thought was a steal. Assuming the above sample is not a details piece (this is an aluminum piece so it's very hard to tell what is cleaning/rubbing vs wear), I wouldn't be surprised if it graded au 50. I'd peg it for an XF45.
Edited by cableguy815
09/29/2017 11:08 pm
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Valued Member
Poland
68 Posts |
I'm sorry, I do not want to be rude, but the information about 600 pieces of this coin is a nonsense. I've been researching Litzmannstadt Getto numismatics for over ten years. I've never found ANY document in ANY archive that shows the real quantity of any of LG coins. All informations about mintage of LG coins are rubbish. For example. All known catalogues present the mintage of 10 mark coin in an amount of 100 000 pieces. Meanwhile in the book "Litzmannstadt Ghetto Chronicle"m which was written in the Ghetto we can read that there were milions pieces of 10 mark coins. The real mintage of coins in unknown. I'm also an author of book "Money of the Lodz Ghetto 1940-1944". You can read some informations about my interests here http://www.litzmannstadt-getto.com. Webpage is available in English. |
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Pillar of the Community
Norway
1358 Posts |
@gumer: Thanks a lot for the information! I'll go and have a look at your website, as it's great to see some more detailed expert knowledge on the topic. Thanks for sharing!
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1949 Posts |
gummer,
Your website opens up, the redirects to adware and spyware when opened. I would love to read your material, but I attempted to open on both my phone and laptop, and as soon as click anywhere, it redirects me to other sites or attempts to download files.
I would like to push back on some of your assertions, but I cannot read your material without being redirected...
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Pillar of the Community
Poland
3201 Posts |
As for buying certified, the upcoming 5th WDA-MiM auction in Poland has some among their listings.
Among them, there is an uncertified 20 mark piece. The description states that "Parchimowicz gives the mintage as 600". This sounds rather inconclusive: a catalog says it's 600 as opposed to the mintage is 600. There indeed must be serious doubts about this being the actual amount minted.
The same auction house also states that "at the moment neither PCGS, nor NGC will grade these coins".
Edited by DL20K
09/30/2017 2:50 pm
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Valued Member
Poland
68 Posts |
@jdmern
Thank you for informing me. I didn;t know that. I scanned my webpage with anti-malware scanners, which fixed some threats. I hope my webpage is clean now.
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Moderator
 United States
34428 Posts |
Website looks clean now. Some interesting and useful info. I hope that you stick around CCF--always great to have an expert around!
@jdmern, congats on a really nice pick-up!
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
Edited by Spence
10/01/2017 12:24 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1314 Posts |
Very informative. Thank you.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1949 Posts |
@ultrarant Quote:
If it sounds surprising that things survived from that period, then I kindly ask you to come and join us in Europe for a few weeks and have a look in some of the sites of World War II. I'll be back over there in a few weeks... I intended to be specific in regards to the carnage of Lodz, not Europe in general... @cableguy Quote:
I wouldn't be surprised if it graded au 50. Nailed it exactly. PCGS graded this one at AU50 @DL20k Quote:
As for buying certified, the upcoming 5th WDA-MiM auction in Poland has some among their listings.
Among them, there is an uncertified 20 mark piece. The description states that "Parchimowicz gives the mintage as 600". This sounds rather inconclusive: a catalog says it's 600 as opposed to the mintage is 600. There indeed must be serious doubts about this being the actual amount minted.
The same auction house also states that "at the moment neither PCGS, nor NGC will grade these coins". Can you link to the auction house's site? Their statement that neither PCGS nor NGC are grading this pieces in not correct. I just had several Lodz pieces graded at PCGS within the past month (although the order took nearly 6 months to be graded, but that's another story) Not to make assumptions on the particular auction house you are referring to, but I have seen many European auction houses offering the 20 Mark pieces as 'unsure of authenticity', and of course, them being counterfeit pieces. The amount of counterfeiting on these pieces cannot be overstated. @gumer Thanks for fixing the site, I will certainly take a look at it later this evening! |
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Valued Member
Poland
68 Posts |
@jdmern Quote:
Their statement that neither PCGS nor NGC are grading this pieces in not correct. . It's a marketing trick. The auction house is known for issuing a lot of nonsense statements. |
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Pillar of the Community
Poland
3201 Posts |
Jdmern, Of course, here's the link. They have 10 coins, 6 of them certified by PCGS. (just in case I'll add that there is no affiliation with them on my part) |
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Valued Member
United States
414 Posts |
Be careful with Polish auctions; let's just say some of them are less than reputable. If you do participate, and win, make sure you verify the heck out of your purchase.
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Replies: 14 / Views: 5,348 |
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Posted 09/29/2017 12:33 pm
