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How Do Ancient Coin Collectors Or Numismatics Make Money?

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hippity's Avatar
United States
6 Posts
 Posted 11/03/2017  3:02 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add hippity to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I assume that coin collectors just buy and resell coins for a higher price but is this true or is there more to it? Or do you just not make money at all and it's just a hobby?
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TheBurnz's Avatar
Canada
586 Posts
 Posted 11/03/2017  3:29 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TheBurnz to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My view, is yes you can make money but it will not come from buying very easy. You will have to be relentless in your searches and dedicate a lot of time in researching what to look for when it comes down to quality and value.
Be prepared to make some mistakes and gradually narrow down you search to something you enjoy and can easily spot when you come across it.
But yes it is a hobby also and you should buy things you like, so if it doesn't sell you would be ok in holding on to it.
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Finn235's Avatar
United States
6130 Posts
 Posted 11/03/2017  3:51 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Finn235 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The process of identifying the unknown adds value, and can be used to turn a profit if that's the goal. I collect to keep my favorite coins, so I am usually excited to get a solid deal, although I could easily turn a significant profit on my best unidentified lot finds.

Unlike world coins, all ancient coins are found as buried treasure, meaning they cost somebody nothing to acquire. Hobby detectorists may take the time to clean, conserve, and identify their finds, or they could simply flip them in bulk.
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sel_69l's Avatar
Australia
21788 Posts
 Posted 11/03/2017  5:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add sel_69l to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I look at an auction pre view on line first, before attending an ancient coin auction view day.
Also, before attending the view day, I do a lot of 'due diligence' with price research for those lots I may be interested in.
I select only one or two lots, and submit single fixed low bids for those lots. I never attend the auction, so I never get involved in bidding wars.

With such a practice, I only have about a 30% success rate; that's OK, but at least it means I can always get coins that I may be interested in, at good price.

THEN I keep them. The last time I sold a coin out of my collection was more than 40 years ago.

How do I make money? I don't, but the value of individual coins over a long period of time has increased by many multiples.

Similar to building a superannuation portfolio, but I will never receive any benefit. However, my kids will, when they re auction the collection after I die. That has been written into my will.
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oriole's Avatar
Canada
5255 Posts
 Posted 11/03/2017  6:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add oriole to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@Hippity, the vast majority of collectors make no money at all. It is a hobby. That being said, the vast majority have or will sometimes be able to find undervalued items that then can resell at a profit. But overall, they just add and make no money.
Edited by oriole
11/03/2017 6:03 pm
Valued Member
Canada
402 Posts
 Posted 11/03/2017  6:06 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cdngmt to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
In economics classes we are always taught that the true value of an item is what it sells for in an auction situation. That is the price a willing buyer will pay for an item a willing seller is offering for sale. Given that coin collecting (and coins) are a dying hobby (check the age of the average collector), the likelihood of prices rising over time is slight to none.

Granted some items may rise in interest and the overall supply may drop due to damage or destruction but the demand (interest is most likely to drop far faster. And within the general trends one MAY be able to trade well and succeed at buying low and selling high(er). BUT most of the "gains" collectors feel they are 'earning' are unrealized and when they (or their heirs) actually try to sell their collections reality comes and bites them (Except that most heirs have no previous thoughts of what the "value" of the collections they now possess and they take the price offered .. which is less than the departed collector was estimating his inventory was worth)
So in short unless the metallic value hits another pea; you better enjoy this as a hobby
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echizento's Avatar
United States
23731 Posts
 Posted 11/03/2017  6:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add echizento to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The word collector imply's someone that keeps what they have. I think you question should have been is "How do dealers make money" Collectors and dealers are two different types, I am a collector I don't sell coins to make money if I sell any at all I sell so that I could buy more coins. We also trade between each other or sell for a few dollars more than what we paid. A collector might buy a lot of coins pick out what fits into his collector trade or sell to another collector for a few dollars. A dealer on the other hand is in business to buy and sell for the most profit they can get. Some are or were collectors, but now it's just a business to them. There are good dealers that sell at a fair price and there are bad ones that mark up what they sell and at time even sell fake coins. Those are quickly identified and usually don't stay in business very long.
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Sap's Avatar
Australia
16868 Posts
 Posted 11/03/2017  11:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would describe my collecting attitude as "Taklamakan style": coins go in, they don't come out again.

The exception is when I (usually accidentally) purchase a duplicate, in which case, whichever one is second-best is sold. I usually sell them at my local coin club auction, and am happy to make a loss on them. Fortunately, it is actually rather hard to obtain "duplicate ancient coins" by my definition, so for ancients this doesn't usually happen to me. I think I've sold three ancient coins in my entire life. (I have bought and kept 437 of them.)
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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louisvillekyshop's Avatar
United States
1308 Posts
 Posted 11/04/2017  03:37 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add louisvillekyshop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hippity;

Clearly you have to change your definition of collector. I collect knowledge and buy large lots from Europe, ID them, and send them off one at a time to buyers, but I purposely keep no notes on any coin that goes through my hands. I want no crutches, I simply want a mind that can recognize even the slightest trait on an ancient coin and then instantly place it with an emperor or Greek city etc. I have been forcing myself to do this for like 20 years now and there have been so many times I pick up a coin I know I "know" but can't remember and I want to curse myself for this crazy plan, but that pain creates a memory and the next time I have a better shot at the instant ID. Now I am 52 I imagine by 70, unless my brain falters, I might be pretty good. So if you can not allow yourself to collect anything but knowledge you will get to hold most of the cheaper ancient coins out there in your hands at one point in your life and you can make money, some. Not much mind you. Like if a coin you sell goes for $15 you are really lucky if you get $5 profit after taxes/selling fees/ etc. And you can't factor in your own time of course. Just do overtime at work and you will make much more money guaranteed then selling coins the honest way. Feel free to get started below. One of many auction houses but this one goes off Sunday Nov 5th. And with the EU you will be waiting months for the coins to arrive if you buy a lot of no id coins.

https://www.biddr.ch/auctions/numis...a=195&c=3041
Edited by louisvillekyshop
11/04/2017 03:38 am
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DavidUK's Avatar
United Kingdom
2624 Posts
 Posted 11/04/2017  06:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add DavidUK to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am not in the business of buying and selling but I have a few thoughts.

1. If you have a premises it may be quite possible to buy items at less than their value. Pawnbrokers and other shops often offer very stingy offers because they hold the cards, often the person wishing to sell is low on options and will accept low offers. If you buy anything for less than its worth you should make money on it.

2. Some people have items on ebay for way more than can be justified but I guess they occasionally get lucky and sell them. Others price far more competitively but sell in large volumes which is OK if they have access to lots of stock.

3. I would hope to make some money long term by virtue of the fact that I don't flip items. Given that money devalues and rare items only get rarer if you buy good items and sit on them for a long period of time one would expect them to increase in value. When I am a pensioner maybe I will be selling items rather than buying them.

4. You can earn money from knowledge... if you see things that others don't (like a rare coin within a lot) or buying unidentified bulk lots and identifying and selling separate there could be potential.

5. I am sure we all heard about someone trading a paper clip up until they had a house? Repeatedly doing trades which are in your favour is another way people build value.

I don't want this hobby to be one that makes me large losses, how you go about things in terms of investment is quite different from the collector mindset (that you need to fill gaps regardless of cost) so internally often I am at conflict with myself. I figure what I lose on the swings I win on the round-a-bouts. Definitely some of the items I have bought have increased in value and others have cost me but across the board I haven't done to badly.
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Spence's Avatar
United States
34443 Posts
 Posted 11/04/2017  5:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@cdngmt, if you are interested how old regular users of this site are, you could look here:

http://goccf.com/t/32889&results=1

I don't know how this sample relates to the entire coin-collecting population, though.
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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