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1947-D Cent With 7/7?

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Bullnuke's Avatar
United States
184 Posts
 Posted 09/29/2008  11:01 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Bullnuke to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hello all,
This is my first post on this web site and maybe my fifth ever on the internet, so if I do something wrong please forgive me as I am fairly computer and internet illiterate. I found this coin while sorting through my wheatie collection, I have not been able to find any info on it anywhere on the net, and reading some of the posts here I thought maybe you guys could help me out. The pictures are not the best quality but I think they show what I am talking about. There appears to be a shadow (correct term?) seven showing on the east side of the real seven. It appears to be about a mm in height and several mm wide. Have I discovered a new error?

1947-D-Cent-With-7/7??

1947-D-Cent-With-7/7??
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vermontensium's Avatar
United States
16677 Posts
 Posted 09/29/2008  11:05 pm  Show Profile   Check vermontensium's eBay Listings Check vermontensium's eCrater Listings Bookmark this reply Add vermontensium to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Welcome Bullnuke! Your pics did not seem to post. Try again.
swcoin.ecrater.com
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 09/29/2008  11:28 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

And a personal welcome also.
Your photos did not come through for some reason. Don't know what you did but I know how you feel. To me also a computer is sort of like the new cars systems. I used to be able to rebuild a car from the bottom up and now I have a hard time finding a dip stick. Same with these stupid computers. I'm learning too so just bear with the problems and don't throw yours against a wall.
As to your coin. There is something about worn dies at the Mint that creats a shadowy effect and makes it appear to be a double die or duplicated date or other numbers/letters. There is a famous 1955 Lincoln Cent like that where the date appears to be a mild form of the famous 1955 double die and is called a poor man's double die.
Without a photo of the coin it is difficult to tell if this is what you have.
I'd try giving you advise on how to post a photo on this site but I'd have a better chance of explaining nuclear fission.
Valued Member
Bullnuke's Avatar
United States
184 Posts
 Posted 09/30/2008  05:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bullnuke to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

There is something about worn dies at the Mint that creats a shadowy effect and makes it appear to be a double die or duplicated date or other numbers/letters

Not sure how you guys put the neat little boxes around stuff in previous posts so I just changed the color to blue. I have a 1996 cent with the shadowy effect (will attempt to add pic ), and this really appears to have a raised surface to it. I think my original pics were too large (< 100k but >500 pixels per side) so I cropped them and am attempting to reload.

http://www.coincommunity.com/forum/...0_1947D4.jpg
http://www.coincommunity.com/forum/...0_1947D5.jpg
http://www.coincommunity.com/forum/...0_1947D6.jpg
1947-D-Cent-With-7/7?? 1996cent.jpg

I think it worked When I previewed the picture links were in blue. So here you go
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 09/30/2008  08:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For sure your photos now came through. To be blunt, not the best photos of coins. Just kidding. I've got 5 digital cameras and having a heck of a time figuring them out. Love the good old days of film cameras.
As for your coin that is exactly what I was talking about. Just that piece of shadowing from a worn out die. Machine Doubling or something like that. Very common on some coins. If you want a real technical explanation someone else here may jump in and explain it all of try https://www.coppercoins.com That is a web site dedicated to only Lincoln Cents and the guy there has two books out on them. I've asked a similar question there and got a great technical explanation but at my age I just forget things like that. I'm still trying to remember what TV show I was just watching.
Pillar of the Community
coppercoins's Avatar
United States
7629 Posts
 Posted 09/30/2008  09:52 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coppercoins to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Just Carl hit it right on the nose. You have abraded die doubling that comes from die wear and nothing else. What causes it is this: As the die wears from striking coins, the molecules of steel that are not in alignment with the rest of the molecules spread outward toward the edge of the design. As the spread outward, they create grooves in the face of the die. This causes the lines we refer to as 'luster' and 'cartwheel' on coins. When this wear becomes excessive it starts to chip away at the edges of the devices farthest from the center of the design that have hard lines perpendicular to the flow of the molecules - those devices that are parallel with the rim. The effect is a cavity in the die which transfers to the coin as a raised hump on the outer edges of these devices. If you look at the top of IN GOD WE TRUST and at the outer (left) edge of the L of LIBERTY, you will likely see the same effect.

This effect became famous during the mad dash to collect and sell 1955 doubled dies. Many people took these coins to dealers thinking they had something special, only to be turned away with a penny in their pocket. After a while these caught on and some unscrupulous dealers started taking advantage of the ill-educated public by calling these 'Poor Man's double dies', selling them for a few dollars each. Truth of the matter is, all these coins are nothing more than normal coins exhibiting excessive die wear. Nearly half of all 1955 cents show this to some degree because the mint used the dies that year far beyond their normal life...reason unknown.

In effect, this form of doubling might be neat to look at, perhaps interesting to collect, but it realistically has no value. They can commonly be found on cents of the following years, although these are not the only years on which this occurs: 1929, 1946, 1947, 1949, 1953, 1954, and 1955.
Valued Member
Bullnuke's Avatar
United States
184 Posts
 Posted 09/30/2008  4:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bullnuke to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree just carl the photos are crappy. But that is what you get when you have to rely on a photographer that has no intrest in coins and doesn't understand what you are looking for in the pictures. Can't complain about the price though (free). I plan on setting up my own little photo lab for future shots. I have an olympus with 10x optical zoom that is tripod mountable and I have been researching lighting setups for coin photography so I should get better.

WOW
coppercoins you were right on the mark. I didn't previously note the same effect on the "L" or "IN GOD WE TRUST" but it is there. That is quite alot of information you packed into that reply. Once I get my pictures down pat I have some other oddities to post that may pique some interest. By the way teriffic website and thanks for the info.
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