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 Replies: 14 / Views: 2,121 |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10284 Posts |
I did not find a discussion on this topic in the forum and thought I would comment on my feelings about the average circ term. Seasoned collectors know that this can mean a condition of anything from AG to bent and corroded coins but I feel it is a very deceiving term and should be done away with. New collectors have been disappointed who fall for this and eagerly open a mail order or auction package they won expecting something that would be the average condition of a circulated coin. When I get change for a dollar, the average condition of the coins in my hand are probably XF or better on the bell curve in grade. What you get when you purchase a roll of average circ coins is quite a crap shoot and this old fashioned term gets the dealer off the hook because he or she did not misrepresent the coin. The definition of average circ is too broad and I wish that dealers would stop disappointing new collectors with selling them something less than they may be expecting.  I say ... Lets call the coins by the grade or at least the grade range such as VG or better. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3499 Posts |
I totally agree. Often the term is used just so that dealers can get rid of their AG & G coins of a given type. It truly is deceptive wording.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6384 Posts |
You're right, Wheezy, it's a deceptive term that misleads newbie collectors. "Average circulated" for Barber coins, for example, generally means AG or Good condition. Unfortunately, there will always be abuses in this hobby and the best course for collectors is to become experienced. I've purchased average circ Barbers before and I've kept the better ones and sold off the culls as junk silver. Fortunately I knew enough not to overpay and I'm satisfied with those transactions. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2734 Posts |
If I get AU-BU State Quarters in my change, can I then tell the sellers that I expect all the 'average circulated' coins they sell to be at least AU?!   I totally agree that your pocket change would grade a lot higher than almost all 'collectible' coins being sold under that old catch-all term!  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
666 Posts |
I agree there's a lot of ambiguity in the term... in my mind Average circulated SBA's would grade AU+ Average circulated memorial cents would grade XF Average circulated Barber dimes would grade G I don't like the term and rarely buy coins described as such. I think it's a cop out to saying "Hey this lot of IHC's is in really bad shape... most are maybe AG, there may be a G or VG coin in the lot that I accidentally included. GOOD LUCK!" |
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Moderator
 United States
188213 Posts |
I agree. Yet one more reason why I prefer to buy at coin dealers or shows.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
632 Posts |
I also agree that the term can be deceptive, but not always.
For example, I've used the term here on the forum and amoungst other collectors at times because I can usually count on them to understand what I mean. This is when I'm just trying to summerize or generalize a coins condition instead of taking the time to be technical. Also, I don't have a whole lot of faith in my grading skills.
If I say, yeah, I have a bunch of average circulated Susie B's. Well a collector would assume that means I have them all in about AU condition because that is the average circulated condition of a susie B. If I say I have a bunch of average circulated 1930 wheats, a collector would assume that their probably around the VG range because thats the common range of an average circulated 1930 wheat. If that pitiful description makes any sense.
Your right though. If your dealing with a sale/buy/trade type situation its better not to use such a vauge term. But if its just a bunch of collectors kibitzing I think we can all grasp ahold of the concept where trying to convey.
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Moderator
United States
188213 Posts |
You make a good point! Just like the "Penny vs. Cent" argument, context is very important.
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Valued Member
United States
327 Posts |
Average circulated= generally thrashed, may be recognizable.
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
10284 Posts |
Glad I have some support on the topic, it just irks me. So happy I'm not alone on this. I do understand that for a given series that there is an average circulated condition and for example, for pre 1940 wheaties it would be probably be around GOOD or maybe VG while average circs for the State Quarters would be XF to AU. However, I just think it would be less of a loophole by calling a coin by what grade it is or what range they may fall in between. So I vow, right here and now, to never sell a coin and describe it as average circ. Guess that's all I can do about it.  LOL! Found this posted by the website The Coin Shop of which I have never dealt with nor have I anything good or bad to say about them. http://coin-shop.com/avecirc.htmlDefinition Of Average Circulated This is a term used to describe a coin based on its age and the amount of wear it would get from being used in normal commerce. Indian Cents:
Typically would grade Good in Average Circulated.
Lincoln Cents:
1909 to 1930 - Typically would grade Good in Average Circulated.
1931 to 1940 - Typically would grade Very Good to Very Fine in Average Circulated.
1940 to present - Typically would grade VF to Almost Uncirculated in Average Circulated.
Buffalo nickels:
1925 to 1938 - Typically would grade Good to Very Fine in Average Circulated.
Jefferson nickels:
1938 to 1958 - Typically would grade Very Good to Very Fine in Average Circulated.
1959 to present - Typically would grade Very Fine to Almost Uncirculated in Average Circulated.
Mercury dimes:
1916 to 1934 - Typically would grade Good to Very Good in Average Circulated.
1935 to 1945 - Typically would grade Very Good to Very Fine in Average Circulated.
Roosevelt dimes:
1946 to present - Typically would grade VG to Almost Uncirculated in Average Circulated.
Washington quarters:
1932 to 1940 - Typically would grade About Good to Good in Average Circulated.
1941 to 1954 - Typically would grade Good to Fine in Average Circulated
1955 to present - Typically would grade Fine to Almost Uncirculated in Average Circulated.
Walking Liberty halves:
1940 to 1947 - Typically would grade Good to Fine in Average Circulated.
Franklin halves:
1948 to 1953 - Typically would grade Good to Fine in Average Circulated.
1954 to 1963 - Typically would grade Fine to Almost Uncirculated in Average Circulated.
This description is provided as a guide only, and does not guarantee the grade of any coin shipped in Average Circulated condition. Edited by TNG
10/10/2008 3:53 pm
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Moderator
United States
188213 Posts |
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However, I just think it would be less of a loophole by calling a coin by what grade it is or what range they may fall in between. Absolutely. When it comes to doing business, the more detailed the better. When it comes to telling your friends about your IHC album, saying "it has average circulated pieces" might be well enough; although a few of my IHC's are better than average!  Quote:
Found this posted by the website The Coin Shop of which I have never dealt with nor have I anything good or bad to say about them. Interesting! I think they make you point with their disclaimer: "This description is provided as a guide only, and does not guarantee the grade of any coin shipped in Average Circulated condition." |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2734 Posts |
At least The Coin Shop lets you see that they have more precise definitions as to how they use the term 'average circulated' for each type of coin, I give them due credit for that. The problem is more like when a novice collector buys something like Barber coins, Standing Liberty quarters or early Walking Liberty half-dollars in 'average circulated' condition, in which case "AG to G" would in fact be a typical condition of those types of coins saved from circulation. If anyone had saved some Barbers in the 1920's, they probably spent them during the Great Depression, so they got worn enough to where they stayed in circulation until the run-up on silver in the early 1960's. The Standing Liberty design wore quickly in circulation, again the Great Depression kept them in circulation until they were worn to "G" or less condition. Same case with the early Walking Libertys. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
869 Posts |
Most people should not even attempt to grade a coin they are trying to sell. Leave it to the professionals. They should put "please grade yourself". And even more so on a rare and vary expensive coinage. That what causes bad feedback. If I'm spending more that $100 on a coin it will have to be slabbed by a good grading company. Also next time you buy a car ask your salesman to go over some of the parts you car is made of. It always good for a laugh like e-bay coin graders. Edited by coindexter
10/10/2008 6:28 pm
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Valued Member
United States
442 Posts |
In my ebay infancy I purchased a roll of mixed Barber and Standing Liberty quarters. My feedback was about 10 and the sellers way up there (talking 1998). Apparently the average American had a thing for carving initials (crudely I might add) into coins. I think I kept 5 and left the rest sitting on my desk. Told my wife "if someone breaks in I hope they steal these". Eventually I sold those on ebay but my title was a bit more honest. I titled it "Crappy Quarters" and was VERY up front about it. I threw in a Silver Eagle as a bonus and actually recovered all of my money. The auction got hundreds of hits just because of the title. I have sold beat up coins on a few occasions. With GOOD pictures and descriptions. Average circulated does mean culls in most cases unfortunately. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2734 Posts |
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They should put "please grade yourself" Yeah, like some of the ebay hustlers who clean and polish common-date wheat pennies and then say "grade the coin yourself from the pictures" so that the uneducated will think they're AU-BU, and by saying 'grade it yourself' the seller is not (technically) misrepresenting their cleaned coins! |
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Replies: 14 / Views: 2,121 |
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Posted 10/09/2008 11:43 pm
