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50c Kennedy 2020 D, Two Step *coin* & Obv. Die Clash! See All&last Comments

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Petespockets55's Avatar
United States
5774 Posts
 Posted 06/18/2020  07:53 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petespockets55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
This is an interesting coin .... for a non-Lincoln.
I agree these 4-6 marks look raised. As such, it isn't PMD from circulation.
The marks are much too precise to be fabricated and added to the coin after it left the mint.(ie: it isn't fake). It even shows signs of a pressure ridge being on the die, to the north of the raised shapes, in the closeup images. (Fantastic, clear images by the way. Always difficult to get on shiny BU coins)

Come on guys and gals, this was part of the die when the coin was struck. I will go out on a limb and say this is die damage and therefore an error coin.

We experienced members may get tired of hearing exuberant claims by new members but we need to look carefully and ask questions as well, not just dig in our heels and say we are right because we've been doing this longer.


Quote:
so are you saying that a struck coin was hard enough to cause these marks on a hardened steel die?

That's the way I'm reading his description. Certainly seems possible. "Scraps" of metal cause die damage (counter-clashes) in the Lincoln series.

I don't believe this would be considered a counter-clash on this coin because it isn't a secondary obverse device. IMHO, this would be very interesting die damage and worth collecting as an error coin.
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We need to consume them regularly to thrive and grow.
Edited by Petespockets55
06/18/2020 07:55 am
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silverwolf's Avatar
Canada
3733 Posts
 Posted 06/18/2020  09:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add silverwolf to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
is it possible to get a side angle picture of the raised area.. if it is in fact on the die, there should be lots more of these out there.
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 Posted 06/18/2020  11:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mikediamond to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
All I can say is that these tooth-like impressions look incuse to me and that each one is bordered by a pressure ridge on the right. That is all consistent with a contact mark.
Error coin writer and researcher.
Edited by mikediamond
06/18/2020 11:29 am
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bobby131313's Avatar
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 Posted 06/18/2020  12:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobby131313 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
They sure looks raised to me Mike. Wierd.
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Chase007's Avatar
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 Posted 06/18/2020  12:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chase007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
This. Seems pretty obvious these are raised not incused, so a hit from a reeded edge is out.


Not so!!

They only appear to be raised but they are 100% not raised, they look that way due to the lighting. I have seen numerous examples of them CRHG.

As I said earlier and Mike Diamond confirmed later, these tooth-like impressions are INCUSE and consistent with contact mark caused by the reeded edge of another coin, it is just a light tricking eyes just like my pics below, don't they look raised?

I just took two handful of Kennedy halves out of my searched bag and walla.. look how many examples of these contact marks were there!
50c-Kennedy-2020-D,-Two-Step-*coin*-&-Obv.-Die-Clash!-See-All&last-Comments
50c-Kennedy-2020-D,-Two-Step-*coin*-&-Obv.-Die-Clash!-See-All&last-Comments
50c-Kennedy-2020-D,-Two-Step-*coin*-&-Obv.-Die-Clash!-See-All&last-Comments
50c-Kennedy-2020-D,-Two-Step-*coin*-&-Obv.-Die-Clash!-See-All&last-Comments
50c-Kennedy-2020-D,-Two-Step-*coin*-&-Obv.-Die-Clash!-See-All&last-Comments
50c-Kennedy-2020-D,-Two-Step-*coin*-&-Obv.-Die-Clash!-See-All&last-Comments
Edited by Chase007
06/18/2020 12:28 pm
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Willburton's Avatar
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 Posted 06/18/2020  12:26 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Willburton to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If you take pictures with the light at the right angle it will appear to be raised. That comes up a lot on here. Like mike diamond said you can clearly see pushed up metal around each depression. Clearly contact marks IMO.
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Petespockets55's Avatar
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 Posted 06/18/2020  12:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Petespockets55 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm seeing them as raised as well.
(And the OP has indicated they are raised but light perception can be "twisted" sometimes.)

stoystown-pa, What direction is the light source coming from in your images?
Can you get a closeup image with the light source at K3 (3:00)
Thanks.

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bobby131313's Avatar
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 Posted 06/18/2020  12:43 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobby131313 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Not so!!


Well the OP has said multiple times that they are and they look raised to many here.
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Chase007's Avatar
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 Posted 06/18/2020  12:53 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chase007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Well the OP has said multiple times that they are and they look raised to many here


The only raised areas on these contact marks are the outer edges of the teeth marks where the metal has been pushed outward. These happen during bagging process at the mint and outside of the mint where numerous coins are dumped and these type contacts occur.
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bobby131313's Avatar
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 Posted 06/18/2020  12:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add bobby131313 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
No idea how you can say that with certainty without the coin in hand.
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stoystown_pa's Avatar
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 Posted 06/18/2020  1:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add stoystown_pa to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi,

Well CHASE007 you hit the preverbal nail on the head. And those photos are very educational. (Thanks for the time and effort. Greatly appreciated!) It's amazing how you reproduced what I was inadvertently photographing! And there were many others who understood how light and shadows can play tricks on any optics. Both mechanical and human. Please see below.

At this late date I'm embarrassed, but hope I didn't totally waste the Coin Community's time.

Thanks everyone for the very thoughtful comments and for all of your time.

Regards,

50c-Kennedy-2020-D,-Two-Step-*coin*-&-Obv.-Die-Clash!-See-All&last-Comments

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Chase007's Avatar
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 Posted 06/18/2020  1:17 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chase007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
bobby,
I am only thinking of the probability of something like this to be struck on a coin during minting process!
Edited by Chase007
06/18/2020 1:24 pm
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Chase007's Avatar
United States
7512 Posts
 Posted 06/18/2020  1:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Chase007 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
stoystown-pa

You are welcome and glad I could be of help to shed some light on this topic

Secondly, there is no need to apologize or to be embarrassed because, quite frankly we have all been there and we have all learned by presenting questions and debating and primarily thanks to the dedicated experts on this site that we are now able to help others. Never stop asking questions!
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coop's Avatar
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62064 Posts
 Posted 06/18/2020  1:45 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add coop to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If it were damaged on the die, it would be raised on the coin. It is incuse, so it is just damage to your coin from another coin.
50c-Kennedy-2020-D,-Two-Step-*coin*-&-Obv.-Die-Clash!-See-All&last-Comments
The collar adds the reeds to the edge of the coin, the dies strike the obverse and reverse sides. So thereeds on the collar and the dies never make contact. reeds on coins don't alter the die as the die is tempered and the coins are annealed. (Softened)
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 Posted 06/18/2020  5:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add mikediamond to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There are actually a few reeded coins that feature a raised sawtooth defect. These are most likely impressions left in the die face when the die struck a collar fragment.
Error coin writer and researcher.
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