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How Many 1793 Ameri Chain Cents Weigh 264 Grains ?

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 Posted 07/17/2021  2:35 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Mgoodrich1914 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
While researching Ameri Chain Cents I found out that,due to rising copper prices congress approved a weight reduction from 264grains(17.11grams)to 208grains(13.48grams).
I haven't been able to find out how many where made at the original 264. Could it be that a 264 is a pattern type?
Any information would be greatly appreciated as I have one of these beautiful coins that weighs 264.4 grains. I'm going to have it appraised but am concerned about the weight.
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westernsky's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2021  3:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add westernsky to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
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Pictures of your cent would be helpful in helping us to help you!
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JimmyD's Avatar
Canada
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 Posted 07/17/2021  5:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add JimmyD to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To the CCF

As stated, we will need clear pictures of both sides in order to help you.
There were several varieties produced and it would help to see which variety you have.
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GrapeCollects's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2021  5:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add GrapeCollects to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply


However I'm already concerned. Chain cents are extremely scarce, and 99.9999% of the time these "beautiful" chain cents aren't genuine. Unless I'm misunderstanding what you're implying by beautiful.
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westcoin's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2021  5:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add westcoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
to the CCF!


Quote:
From an E-Sylum v9n48 Article #9

1793 LARGE CENT WEIGHT CHANGE

Last week I wrote that "The U.S. large cent was introduced in 1793,
but the next production cost decision was postponed for 64 years to
1857 when the size and composition were changed."

Bob Neale writes: "True enough, but don't forget that the first
cost decision was made before any cents were ever minted. Congress
amended Statute One, the April 1792 basic coinage act, on 14 January
1793 to lower the coin's weight from 208 (Birch cent weight) to 164
grains (chain cent weight)."


SOURCE:
https://www.coinbooks.org/club_nbs_..._v09n48.html

*I believe that is a typo in the quote - as Birch cents weigh 264 & 260 grains and Chain Cents weigh 208 grains.


The weights in grains aren't exactly what was specified in law at the time, they used pennyweights; 11 pennyweight per cent which amounts to the 17.11 grams. The actual weights are drawn up in the Coinage act of April 2, 1792 (sec. 9)

https://www.usmint.gov/learn/histor...april-2-1792

The January 14, 1793, Statue 1, which changed the amount of copper needed to make cents and Half Cents:
How-Many-1793-Ameri-Chain-Cents-Weigh-264-Grains-?

The US Mint began striking the 1793 cents in Late February through early March when they ran out of planchets. So none should have been struck at the original weight designated at 264 grains. All struck should be at the new amended weight of 208 grains. That's a 2.5 gram reduction.

You say you have a 1793 chain cent which weighs 264.4 grains, that is quite interesting, I would also take it the cent has little circulation to be at the full weight as well? Unless the planchets had already been prepared for use at the mint before the new money saving weight reduction was ruled on. Other pre Federal coins from that era like Fugio cents were even lighter generally.

I agree we need photos full obverse and reverse as well as the edge showing the thickness. Possibly a thick planchet as these were hand rolled out and nothing was as precise back then, compared to how much more quality control came about when getting better equipment and moving to steam power.

264.4 grains would be close to 17 grams or 3.5 grams heavier than a standard chain cent, and right at where a Birch cent would weigh. Very interesting indeed.
"Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013!
ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1981, ANS, Early American Coppers Member (EAC), Colonial Coin Collectors Club member (C4), Conder Token Collector Club member (CTCC), Civil War Token Society (CWTS) member, Liberty Seated Collectors Club (LSCC) & Numismatic Bibliomania Society member (NBS), USMex, Member in good standing, 2¢ variety collector.

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Edited by westcoin
07/17/2021 6:09 pm
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 Posted 07/17/2021  6:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Mgoodrich1914 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have pictures on my phone but can't figure out how to post them.
Obviously I'm not tech savy,but this should be easy. My age is showing.
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westernsky's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2021  8:23 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add westernsky to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The key to posting pictures is to get them cropped and sized correctly (then saved to a new file) BEFORE trying to post them.
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Spence's Avatar
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 Posted 07/17/2021  8:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@mgoo, first welcome to CCF.


Quote:
I have pictures on my phone but can't figure out how to post them


Second, here is a link to the tutorial on uploading pics:

https://www.coincommunity.com/forum...g-images.asp

I look forward to seeing your chain cent!

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"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
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New Member
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 Posted 07/17/2021  11:03 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Mgoodrich1914 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I have pictures on my phone but can't figure out how to post them.
Obviously I'm not tech savy,but this should be easy. My age is showing.
How-Many-1793-Ameri-Chain-Cents-Weigh-264-Grains-?
How-Many-1793-Ameri-Chain-Cents-Weigh-264-Grains-?
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 Posted 07/17/2021  11:41 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Mgoodrich1914 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I hope these pictures help.
As you can see my phone doesn't take very good pics.
I'll try to find a way to gauge the thickness and post the picture.
Thank you for all input.
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westcoin's Avatar
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 Posted 07/18/2021  12:16 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add westcoin to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Unfortunately we will need in focus images, these are too blurry to tell whats going on at all. If you are hand holding the phone, then try instead to put it on a box or a stack of books, anything solid where it won't move when taking the photo, books let you raise and lower it as needed, then get enough light on the coin, tap the screen where you want to focus the camera at (I like to use part of the design, like the face profile).

If we can get better photos we might have a good chance of helping you out. I'd like to see the edge as well in focus and either with another known coin as a guide or standard, like a quarter, or better a ruler.

You might try watching these, they may help you out:

HniZ5Vp5Bvo


bMrUniZS4Rc
"Buy the Book Before You Buy the Coin" - Aaron R. Feldman - "And read it" - Me 2013!
ANA Life Member #3288 in good standing since 1981, ANS, Early American Coppers Member (EAC), Colonial Coin Collectors Club member (C4), Conder Token Collector Club member (CTCC), Civil War Token Society (CWTS) member, Liberty Seated Collectors Club (LSCC) & Numismatic Bibliomania Society member (NBS), USMex, Member in good standing, 2¢ variety collector.

See my want page: http://goccf.com/t/140440
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GrapeCollects's Avatar
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 Posted 07/18/2021  11:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add GrapeCollects to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hate to tell you but, that chain cent is 100% not genuine. Chain cents were made of copper, not a silvery base metal.
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 Posted 07/18/2021  8:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Oldfordman to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
to the Community!
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westernsky's Avatar
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 Posted 07/18/2021  9:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add westernsky to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Based on what I can see SO FAR this coin is most likely a replica or counterfeit of some sort.

Better, well-focused pictures wiould be helpful.
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 07/19/2021  10:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Mgoodrich1914 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
How-Many-1793-Ameri-Chain-Cents-Weigh-264-Grains-?
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