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Replies: 28 / Views: 2,650 |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1186 Posts |
Okiecoiner, The dates I suggested in that post were not meant to be taken literally, I made it clear they were only a guess with no certainty or documentation to back them up. I have plans on taking a trip to the Bank of Canada Museum in Ottawa when things start opening back up to do some research regarding dies and the amounts used for certain years. I am also going to try and get to the bottom of exactly when the Single-Squeeze method was introduced for each denomination. When thinking of the Single-Squeeze method, usually the doubled design elements are restricted to the center of the die and not the legends or designs closer to the rim. But when we think of the multi-hubbing method used before single-squeeze, you get doubled elements visible in legends, portraits, designer initials etc. Now some say the single squeeze method was introduced in the 1980s to sometime in the 2000s and everywhere in between, but for the Two Dollar coin, we find 2012 and the 2013 toonies chucked full of DDR's and DDO's with major doubling present that looks exactly like a doubled hubbing impression on the working dies. So, long story short single-squeeze might not have even been introduced at all until well after 2013+ for the Canadian Two Dollar coin, what I DO know is that the single squeeze method was gradually introduced to each denomination over a long period of time, not all at once.
Finding and discovering modern Canadian doubled die varieties since 2018. 2023 Recent Publications: Modern Canadian Doubled Die Varieties - First Edition PDF & Paperback https://www.mcddv.ca (website currently down for maintenance as of 08/01/2024)
Edited by JohnWayne007 11/10/2021 4:20 pm
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5589 Posts |
It would be great to have someone with lots of older toonie hoards to see what kind of percentage of the coins appear to be similar to the OP's coins. If they are few, it didn't come from a hub because any number of working dies would have been affected and hundreds of thousands, if not millions, would be appearing if the hub was involved. I, as a degreed mechanical engineer with lots of machine-shop experience, don't see how it's possible to have hub/matrix doubling involved to account for the very few examples that have been found. Maybe no one is looking, but numbers may be the answer to this quandary as to when the single-squezze started up here.
Edited by okiecoiner 11/10/2021 4:54 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1186 Posts |
Quote: Maybe no one is looking This is exactly what fuels my research, there is a plethora of modern Canadian doubled dies in circulation, mint sets, rolls, even on dealer's shelves collecting dust, some extremely common and some extremely hard to find, yet nobody knows about them because collectors have no idea what to even look for, so how can they... I wouldn't doubt it if I currently have one of the largest Modern Canadian doubled die collections known to exist, mainly because I know exactly what I'm looking for, and sooner or later everyone else will as well, and eventually, once numbers start climbing for examples being found we will know exactly which ones are actually worth searching for.
Finding and discovering modern Canadian doubled die varieties since 2018. 2023 Recent Publications: Modern Canadian Doubled Die Varieties - First Edition PDF & Paperback https://www.mcddv.ca (website currently down for maintenance as of 08/01/2024)
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5589 Posts |
My hat's off to you JohnWayne, as I've said before on a couple different sites.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts |
Any ETA on you book johnwayn007 I have been learning more about looking specifically for split serifs and believe I have found at least 1 decent one but don't bother posting anything that requires me to take screen shots of my scope from my phone. I have found a few extra claw nickels(still no extra spine or budds on my cent coins) but I never hear dimes and quarters discussed on here with true doubled dies. The odd loonie and toonie but even those have been semi inconclusive. I have no idea where to look for single squeeze die doubling on quarters and dimes, and it seems even in the 60s the doubling on most nickels looks like single squeeze die doubling. I have been slowly going through the RCNA archives for older coin info and some modern, though it seems there is a huge gap in research between American and Canadian coinage and I would love to have access to so accurate information for errors. Okie you have mentioned a Canadian book on errors before but I doubt it covers anything modern. That all being said even the semi older coins 1920-1980 have very little info on what to actually look for. I check all of my coins(every coin that passes my hand) under my bad loupe,which reminds me to get a better one. Any mid grade fairly cheap loupe that you guys would recommend I get? Preferably 50$ or under. It is much more of a slow process with the lack of information for errors. I have changed my focus to putting together basic sets for myself(going pretty good) but my main curiousity is still errors. I don't have the time to look for new varieties or anything.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts |
Also I do kind of agree with Okies original opinion. I do see the notching but not split serifs. You have way more knowledge with these things them I do, this one in particular confuses. Do Canadian doubled dies have more then 1 form? Is it due to the strike process specifically? I think I'd need a really good explanation to understand how this is a doubled die and not MD. And of it is a doubled die how do you tell the difference from MD? Or Strike Doubling?
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5589 Posts |
Wrekkdd. For one thing there are NO serifs with the font used on the toonies. Look up the definition. I sent you a list of links that fully explain all the different kind of varieites and common errors ... read about the process.. As JohnWayne has explained, Strike Doubling is just another word for MD
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1186 Posts |
Quote: For one thing there are NO serifs with the font used on the toonies You are correct, however I do think you are taking the "Serifs" thing too literal, the fonts used from 1920-1980s had Serifs, and the fonts used from 1980 to present were and are referred to as a "Sans-Serif" font, meaning a font without serifs. The issue is everyone knows exactly where to look when you say "Split Serif" and provide a photo of a letter or number, regardless of if it is the correct terminology or not. Quote: Any ETA on you book johnwayn007 Paperback should start being available by the end of the month, likely sooner if I can help it, PDF copies pending, the file is being optimized for different device sizes, so ASAP once finished.
Finding and discovering modern Canadian doubled die varieties since 2018. 2023 Recent Publications: Modern Canadian Doubled Die Varieties - First Edition PDF & Paperback https://www.mcddv.ca (website currently down for maintenance as of 08/01/2024)
Edited by JohnWayne007 11/10/2021 8:07 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts |
Sorry I'm well aware Strike Doubling and MD are the same I just have heard the same term used on Machine Doubling so I figured I would explain further by putting both names for the same thing. I'm also well aware now of Die Deterioration on coins now. The new one for me was rust under plating for the old chrome plated nickels I have been finding. I will check out the links you sent, appreciate it. I don't mean to question someone with more knowledge then me on these topics and that's why I'm excited to read about your experience on the topic. I'm not sure what the book will cost but I already put aside what I believe should cover it.
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
3328 Posts |
I wanted to read the paper SPP posted a link to omw home from work but it refuses to open for some reason.
@SPP,I am enjoying the articles you have written , the spice is one of my favorite articles so far, though there is a lot of other great info.
@johnwayn007, are you aware of any business strike toonies that have the same doubling?
Edit:where will I be able to purchase the book?
Edited by Wrekkdd 11/12/2021 5:59 pm
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1186 Posts |
Quote: @johnwayn007, are you aware of any business strike toonies that have the same doubling? Yes, that is one of the few reasons why I am so confident in this one. Quote: Edit:where will I be able to purchase the book? eBooks and Paperback can be ordered directly through my site when it goes live, paperback copies will also be available through other physical locations that sell books and have access to search and order books by a provided ISBN. Once everything is finished I will provide all the details.
Finding and discovering modern Canadian doubled die varieties since 2018. 2023 Recent Publications: Modern Canadian Doubled Die Varieties - First Edition PDF & Paperback https://www.mcddv.ca (website currently down for maintenance as of 08/01/2024)
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
9865 Posts |
Are you saying that the die used to strike PL coins was also used for business strikes?
"Dipping" is not considered cleaning... -from PCGS website
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1186 Posts |
DBM, No, I'm saying I have seen the same form of doubling on business strike toonies in general, so I know that this doubling is not just on PL, but can also be found on business strike.
Finding and discovering modern Canadian doubled die varieties since 2018. 2023 Recent Publications: Modern Canadian Doubled Die Varieties - First Edition PDF & Paperback https://www.mcddv.ca (website currently down for maintenance as of 08/01/2024)
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Replies: 28 / Views: 2,650 |