1998 W Proof-Like 2 Dollar Coin DDR

I recommended for Darren to post this here as it is a Doubled Die Reverse, the photos with the red highlights I actually did for him over on facebook.

When the working punch was hubbed to create the working die, during the first hubbing impression the working punch was not fully sunken into the working die, when the second hubbing impression came around it was slightly rotated and was fully sunken into the working die and thus leaving split serifs found on the "A" and notching on the bottom left hand side of the "D".

Edit: To further explain, the "shelf-like appearance" is due to the already flattened style of the devices used across numerous modern Canadian denominations and the different pressure between both hubbing impressions, creating 2 heights on the devices that look step like.

All working dies get hubbed more than once for the best relief possible, so during the second hubbing impression if it is slightly tilted or rotated you will get exactly what the OP has posted.

Well JohnWayne, you are the error guru for most Canadian coins, so I'll defer to what you are saying. I was under the impression that all toonies started with the single-squeeze impression. As we have discussed before there is a huge difference in the nomenclature between US and Canadian folks. What the two of us know as a "hub" is entirely different, so hub-doubling takes on a whole new meaning. I use matrices and submatrix that you have a different name for. I'll leave it to you to tell the folks here what is a DDO or DDR but, like I said, I don't think that is what the OP's coin shows. Discussion sites are there for the purpose of putting down opinions and passing along information. I could care less about errors, but wanted to ensure that good information was passed and people not being misled. I will stay out of modern Canadian coinage errors for the time being and let you-all solve the probs.

For now, since I cannot examine this in hand and I am only going by photos, I am putting this one on the back burner until I can search 1998 W's thoroughly and have an example in hand to examine and thoroughly confirm. I still have a strong suspicion of it being genuine but I will update here when I do so, I don't mind admitting when/if I am wrong.

Stanton's paper is the clearest, most succinct source on this I have seen. It was an appendix to one of the editions of the "Cherry Picker's Guide." Really well written. I can't say I am the one who first posted a link to it here, but I might have been.

And I just read the paper/research that I hadn't seen before and, without the coin in hand, I think that the OP's coin almost fully matches the paper's pics of " Strike Doubling" and which I've always called machine or Mechanical Doubling. I still, in my own mind, wouldn't call it DDO or DDR.. I will back out of this discussion for good and leave to you error guys to further split the hair. Since old Vicky varieties are my primary interest and I fully understand and collect their anomalies and the complete minting process, I just stick with my babies. When part of the minting/striking process takes 2-4 hard strikes with the punch to fully impress a working die, it's very easy to see doublings or triples. Modern coin production has overshot what I want to retain concerning minting. My coin interest doesn't extend beyond WWl

Thanks Spp for reposting that article. I read it throughly and it does show examples and clear up some questions for me as to true doubles dies. I value everyone's opinion here greatly and I must say this example had me debating whether mechanical or truly doubled. For my own experience I will need to seek some out for submission here and see what you all think. One of my favourite things about this site is I seem to learn something everyday and this thread proves that exactly.

Well, I DID say that I'd closed my opinion on the "modern doubled" coins, but just saw this in the archives.

http://goccf.com/t/406840#3495369

To me, using a single squeeze method for the dies eliminates the possibility of having a double or doubled die. I found this thread from a few months ago as to estimated dates.. Again, the OP's coin looks to me like Mechanical Doubling and you can follow with your eyes and mind what would happen if the die moved a teeny bit. Who knows until someone knowledgeable from the Mint chimes in.