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 Replies: 37 / Views: 1,664 |
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Valued Member
United States
184 Posts |
I never bought a coin for "investment" in 50 years. And never sold a coin yet. Still, I always wanted to own a rare and beautiful coin, but was too young to be able to afford one. Now that I am retired and older and have more money, I would like to buy a coin that is at the top or near top of its class. But since I am not that wealthy that I can just snap up any coins for my own gratification without any consideration for losing money on it on the long run, I would like you to recommend your idea of a coin that is not only near top/at top within its niche, but also would have the potential for appreciation. Otherwise, I just invest the money in the stock market. The single coin must be between $10k-$50K and can be US or world. But I am in the US, so probably US coins would appreciate more or could be sold easier at a later date (unless I fall in love with it) or passed on to the family. Appreciate any inputs! Edited by NJcoppers
04/28/2024 5:47 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3535 Posts |
I like gold, so how about a 1911 Saint Gaudens $20 in about MS64-65 cond.
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Moderator
 United States
54280 Posts |
Buy CAC graded or CAS stickered early gold.
Show your financial support of the Coin Community Family (click here)See my topic on Mexican Numismatic Medals (click here) |
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Moderator
United States
34397 Posts |
For me, this would be a chain cent for the aesthetics, but not sure about the potential for appreciation.
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb
"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
-----King Adz
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
6492 Posts |
Yeah, an early cent sounds right. Graded and certified, of course. But if appreciation could be guaranteed, then big money would have already snapped them up and pushed up prices. I don't know that I could bring myself to invest $50000 in a single fragile physical asset that must then be stored, guarded, and ultimately liquidated in the future.
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Valued Member
United States
136 Posts |
Okay so this is a bit controversial because I am not sure if this would trade under 50k, however the truth is that meiji rairities have been hit a bit lately in USD price terms simply because the biggest market is japan and they tend to trade in JPY. Since 2017 when this was last sold for just under 80k, a few (and I mean a few) pieces that were expected to reach good levels failed to do so so it might JUST be possible to get this for 50k if it came back on the market today. https://coins.ha.com/itm/japan/japa...3051-34336.sProbably not that useful for you, but for me if I had to put 50k anywhere today and I could get that coin for 50k I would do it. The fact that even Dr Norman Jacobs who was maybe the preeminent meiji coin collector ever in the west didn't have this shows just how extreme the rarity is and if I could get it at that price I would keep it for decades and expect a huge amount of appreciation in price over time. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
94367 Posts |
None of these - I'd buy $50K of an S&P500 Index Fund.
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Pillar of the Community
Russian Federation
5172 Posts |
Quote:
None of these - I'd buy $50K of an S&P500 Index Fund.  But if I had to guess: some kind of high-grade Charlotte or Dahlonega gold coin. Don't know remotely enough about those series to say exactly which though. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6492 Posts |
Given the new antiquities and customs laws regarding coins, isn't there a considerable risk to owning a super expensive foreign antique coin? All some government has to do is to challenge your provenance, and it seems like you might be in trouble.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
7936 Posts |
Quote:
None of these - I'd buy $50K of an S&P500 Index Fund. You betcha. Because ... If you were asked this question 5 years ago, and did exactly that, you would now have over $80,000. That gives you $30,000 to buy the coin of your dreams, then re-invest the $50,000 and start all over again. |
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Valued Member
 United States
184 Posts |
Thank you for all the valuable comments! To address some of the comments... I agree that the SP500 (I actually would go with the MTUM ETF from Blackrock) would be a smarter "investment", but I already have investments. I do not want to "invest" in coins. I would like to combine my appreciation for the numismatics and the dream to own an average folk's "semi-super coin" with the potential for investment, only in order to be able to justify spending that much on a coin. @tdziemia outlined the reason for the SP500 route very well, and I agree with him. There is an "opportunity cost" that I want to cover with this coin purchase. There is higher risk in being able to make $30K profit on a $50 investment in 5 years with a rare coin vs the SP500. But can you admire your stocks during that 5 years as much as a rare coin you are proud of and has "your name on it"? So the reason for searching for a rare coin that I want to love it AND at the same time while I have it, it will appreciate in price as well. Because there is an "opportunity cost" that average folks like me cannot afford to ignore at a <$50k purchase. Yes, must be PCGS or NGC....and I guess CAC approved. That gives you a near exact repeatable value. Now there are some very legitimate concerns about safe keeping and the proper climatic environment for storing it, etc. I am not well versed with US coins, except NJ coppers, but I have deep appreciation for the chain cents not only because of their truly classical portrayals, but also because they are contemporaries of my NJ coppers. But I am less inclined to consider copper because of the potential for disease progression, etc. (I am not an expert coin guy, so correct me if I am wrong). Silver is more preferable than gold, just because IMHO there may be more chances that I can come up with a "sleeper" in silver coins vs gold. But gold does not corrode, so as far as lacking high-tech storing....gold may be the better route. @manosgerms: If you would have asked me a week ago what is a meiji, I would have had no clue at all. https://www.ha.com/c/search/results...h-A-K-071316But, coincidentally I was looking on ebay a coin that is a Year 13 (1880) (I believe the rarest year for the proofs) that looked like it could be a proof, although no record of a proof being made in the 1 sen denomination. So for $6 I figured...what the hell, maybe I will hit the lottery...and so I bought it. When it arrived, it was all copper color and did not look at all like the ebay photo :) This is the ebay coin photo:  And the real ebay coin's color (just a sample coin, not the actual ebay coin I bought): And these are the real valuable denomintations from Heritage:  Edited by NJcoppers
04/28/2024 11:21 pm
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Valued Member
United States
136 Posts |
@NJCoppers Wow you seem to do your research extremely fast! Also your intuition is very good too. Just to put your mind at rest, whilst that 1 Sen you saw is super nice looking, it is probably (though I would have to see it in hand to say definitively if at all) NOT a proof. My reasons for saying this is because of a couple of things I see in the photo. The first, is that I have had the privilege of handling a few proofs from 1880 and I even own one. Now each and every one of them had devices that were so crisp it is enough to take your breath away. This one does not ... it has very nice devices but they just aren't quite the quality of what I have seen in each and every meiji proof I have handled. The second thing is that in the proofs the rim tends to be much squarer and this seems to be rounded. This is a telltale sign - sometimes non proofs have quite a strongly defined rim particularly 2 Sen pieces but I have never seen a proof without one The oxidation pattern I must say is very reminiscent of a real proof but the first two issues to me negate the possibility. It MIGHT have been a proof that has seen circulation and the fact that Dr Norman Jacobs seems to have actually found a couple) might bear this out but the wear doesn't quite look to me like it was super crisp strike that was handled a lot. As you point out there is no record at all of a 1 Sen proof in 1880 but if it was made 1880 would be the year as that was the only year when proofs were indeed officially made in a small amount . There are proofs for a number of years but the official records if they exist would be either somewhere in the vaults of the BOJ or, more likely, in the imperial palace itself and if so even the most favored scholars would not be able to access them for the moment. Whilst it is known that Japan DID mint proofs for the 1892-93 World's Columbian exhibition the suspicion is that they actually used dies from 1870 and made proofs with those (they were a completely different design) but again things are unclear. Having said that if your coin is in as good a shape as the Meiji 10, the 1877 sample coin you showed for the color, then it is probably worth more than the 6 bucks you paid for it. One final thing. Some Meiji coins look just amazing that one might think they MUST be proofs. Not really so. Check out this listing still on ebay. it is a fantastic MS65 red 1880 1 Sen and the devices are amazing but possibly because of the rim this didn't get a proof designation and I also kind of agree its not. But in most other series this would certainly be PL or DPL as a designation. Just search for Japan - 1880 - 1 Sen - MS 65 RD. It is a gorgeous coin just not quite worth the price of basically 1k, although I expect that whoever owned it raw might have been hoping for a proof designation from NGC:( And if you cannot obtain my suggestion - it really is almost unique something like this https://coins.ha.com/itm/japan/meij...ion-120115#a is more attainable in terms of stuff coming on the market and the next time one comes up it should trade below 50k without issue but these Meiji proofs are ALL so rare and so beautiful that for the long term I have no doubt they are great investments especially when you take into account that for example in this 1874 just the business strike at MS62 would easily be worth a few 1000 USD. And the proof is hundreds of times rarer and unlike US proofs their official issuances are extremely opaque and would have been bespoke one at a time for something very special usually to do with the emperor himself. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10982 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
5394 Posts |
Agree with Frog.
You do not buy coins as an investment.
Put the 50k into solid dividend stocks
That said for enjoyment of spending the money
.probably ...
Upgrade my 1795 Dollar ( current VF25
NGC) to a mint state example.
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Moderator
United States
188052 Posts |
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Agree with Frog. You do not buy coins as an investment. I agree with the agree.  Now, if I had $10k-$50k to blow on just one coin, it would have to be the most expensive Ike I could find.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6492 Posts |
Would $50000 be enough to buy the 1971 Ike variety that was struck for politician samples and handed out by the President?
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Replies: 37 / Views: 1,664 |
Posted 04/28/2024 5:44 pm
