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1814 Capped Bust Half O-108A E Over A - Keep Or Return, What's Your Vote?

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Pillar of the Community

United States
878 Posts
 Posted 05/16/2024  11:31 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add adam126402 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I'd like to hear what the CCF has to say on this one. First two pics were sellers, following three are mine. Overall, I liked the coin although the area below the motto on the reverse looked a little suspicious, but there also appeared to be double clashing directly underneath "BUS," so was not sure what exactly was going on. I decided to bid with return option. From all of PCGS and NGC graded 108a's I've looked through, this looks somewhere between VF25/35. I've also noticed some quite forgiving grading on this variety by both PCGS and NGC.

I paid $394 delivered.The graffiti looks like the initials JHB to me and is very shallow and barely noticeable in hand with 3x glass. The picture highlighting the graffiti was taken under harsh lighting to make it pop. The seller made no representations about grade or otherwise other than "nice coin."

So what are your thoughts, what's your vote?

1814-Capped-Bust-Half-O-108A--E-Over-A---Keep-Or-Return,-What's-Your-Vote?
1814-Capped-Bust-Half-O-108A--E-Over-A---Keep-Or-Return,-What's-Your-Vote?
1814-Capped-Bust-Half-O-108A--E-Over-A---Keep-Or-Return,-What's-Your-Vote?
1814-Capped-Bust-Half-O-108A--E-Over-A---Keep-Or-Return,-What's-Your-Vote?
1814-Capped-Bust-Half-O-108A--E-Over-A---Keep-Or-Return,-What's-Your-Vote?
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Zurie's Avatar
United States
5663 Posts
 Posted 05/16/2024  11:58 pm  Show Profile   Check Zurie's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Zurie to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It's a nice looking coin for the variety, but the graffiti ruins it for me. I would return it for sure.
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Errers and Varietys's Avatar
United States
73844 Posts
 Posted 05/16/2024  11:59 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Errers and Varietys to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
VF details, scratched. I'd return it. It's a deal breaker for me.
Errers and Varietys.
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Jaobler's Avatar
United States
6383 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  12:13 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jaobler to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Guess this is a scarce variety and hard to find problem-free. Price seems a bit high for a VF Details piece with graffiti but perhaps the opportunity to buy one doesn't come by very often.
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Russian Federation
5172 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  05:54 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add january1may to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not being familiar with the variety: what's going on at 2-7h on the obverse, next to the date and the right set of stars? It looks like a lot of scratching to me but it I guess maybe it's actually a lot of overlapping clashes (at least 4, maybe more).
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Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  10:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Strictly from an an appearance standpoint, not a fan.
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GERMANICVS's Avatar
Germany
1849 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  10:09 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add GERMANICVS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hmmm....the graffiti would rule this one out for me as well, at the price the seller wants.

The 1814 A over A is not scarce at R-1, but quite popular from what I have seen, so this drives up the price. There are 14 available on ebay right now.

For comparison, this is my example. The weakness at the wings and eagle is typical for the variety, as I learnt.





1814-Capped-Bust-Half-O-108A--E-Over-A---Keep-Or-Return,-What's-Your-Vote?
Edited by GERMANICVS
05/17/2024 10:10 am
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panzaldi's Avatar
United States
18645 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  11:20 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add panzaldi to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
i'd call it VF30 details (graffiti)

just a personal preference, I would not spend that kind of $$ on a graffiti coin if I could find a straight 30 for the same price. a straight 30 sold for $384 in august and if the coin came in at 25 then it was way overpriced imo. sorry, my vote is even if it was $100 less

the clashing is pretty wicked on it
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paralyse's Avatar
United States
12057 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  12:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add paralyse to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Send her back. Even if you don't mind the graffiti, it will probably compromise future resale value.
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jpbone's Avatar
United States
1959 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  2:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jpbone to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not a fan.
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IndianGoldEagle's Avatar
United States
36678 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  4:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add IndianGoldEagle to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Return it, damaged coin.
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jacrispies's Avatar
United States
3848 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  4:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jacrispies to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'd say it falls on the 35/40 details range. For $400, in this grade with the graffiti, the patina needs to be stunning for the price to be justified. The fact it is bright/cleaned plus the graffiti, I would pass. This variety is available in eye appealing condition, but the examples are held in tight collector's hands. Patience is key with the O-108.

Here is my example:
1814-Capped-Bust-Half-O-108A--E-Over-A---Keep-Or-Return,-What's-Your-Vote?
1814-Capped-Bust-Half-O-108A--E-Over-A---Keep-Or-Return,-What's-Your-Vote?
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Shoot me a PM if you are looking to sell bust halves.
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Coinfrog's Avatar
United States
94367 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  5:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Lots of good input, so what are you thinkinig?
Pillar of the Community
United States
878 Posts
 Posted 05/17/2024  6:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add adam126402 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the feedback everyone. My feelings one way or another were pretty neural, given all of the coins, sold and unsold, that I've looked at.

However, the consensus here is unanimous, so going with that and will return it and keep hunting for a more appealing problem free example.

———-Large Edit————

A few more thoughts on this one as I re-read the feedback. Not sure how familiar everyone is with 1814 E/A pricing over generic 1814. Graysheet VF20 retail is $488 vs $273, and the sold listings at Heritage, ebay, Great Collections, and Graysheet marketplace back up the spread across the grading spectrum.

The VF30 Panzaldi referenced, assuming it was the same Stacks Bowers sale in August 2023 that I saw, is a non E/A 1814 in a PCGS holder. In E/A, it would probably sell in the $600+ range. What I would consider an ugly E/A VF20 that sold on GC went for $528. A cleaned XF details, early die state E/A, no clashing or die cracks, sold for $530.

Then there is an early die state E/A straight grade VF35 that sold for $660 in 2022 on Heritage that IMO is not attractive. And this well circulated flat grey example has almost no toning, how's that even possible? As I've looked at many dozens of example of this variety over the last few months, I've seen a good number of PCGS and NGC straight graded 1814 E/A that are suspect, IMO, and ugly. Jacrispies coin is an attractive XF40+ IMO and is easily a $1,000 coin in the current market.

So my overall ambivalence for this coin at the price paid is based on what I see in the market place. I also prefer raw coins. If the graffiti was instead just some random light scratches in that area, I wouldn't even be considering returning it. So finding what I desire is even more limited since so many have been holdered.

With that, if any of you have a lead on an unholdered straight gradable attractive 108a in high VF range for $400 to $500, hit me up!

Cheers!
Edited by adam126402
05/18/2024 12:09 am
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GERMANICVS's Avatar
Germany
1849 Posts
 Posted 05/18/2024  07:32 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add GERMANICVS to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I bought my example in Europe and paid the equivalent of $ 175. However, this is probably not a good point of reference.
Edited by GERMANICVS
05/18/2024 09:53 am
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psuman08's Avatar
United States
1763 Posts
 Posted 05/18/2024  4:05 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add psuman08 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Looks like graffiti on the obverse as well next to S4. Pass.
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