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Any Idea Of This 1819 Capped Bust Half Variety?

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Moe145's Avatar
United States
8904 Posts
 Posted 08/06/2009  12:10 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Moe145 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I photographed this coin today and the more I looked at it the more confused I got.

It doesn't seem to be an 1819 over 8 variety (the only variety I know, either large or small 9). But there is definitely some overstamp ("re-punch") of the date. The first one and the second one are doubled at the top and the 9 is as well.

But the over-stamp ("re-punched") on the top of the 8 is what is confusing to me. I don't see what could have made the wide arc over the 8.

And the bottom of the States on the reverse is misaligned (a LOT).

I did see many weak die errors around the E Plu of this reverse pattern in other coins (so this doesn't look too weird (as in strange wear patterns...) And the points of the stars on the obverse going all the way to to the edge is strange. And the marks on the edge from the UNITED.

Any one care to weigh in on this one? Variety? Over-stamp ("re-punched") possibility?



Any-Idea-Of-This-1819-Capped-Bust-Half--Variety??

Any-Idea-Of-This-1819-Capped-Bust-Half--Variety??

Any-Idea-Of-This-1819-Capped-Bust-Half--Variety??



Any-Idea-Of-This-1819-Capped-Bust-Half--Variety??

Any-Idea-Of-This-1819-Capped-Bust-Half--Variety??

Any-Idea-Of-This-1819-Capped-Bust-Half--Variety??

Any-Idea-Of-This-1819-Capped-Bust-Half--Variety??

Any-Idea-Of-This-1819-Capped-Bust-Half--Variety??

Any-Idea-Of-This-1819-Capped-Bust-Half--Variety??



Edited by Moe145
08/06/2009 12:08 pm
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ratman4762's Avatar
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2520 Posts
 Posted 08/06/2009  01:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ratman4762 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I figure it to be O-111, R2. I ruled out 7 of the possible 15 varieties with the position of the "I" in Pluribus beneath the "T" in States. The low position of the "E" in States ruled out another 5. The shorter distance between stars 1 & 2, than the rest of the stars ruled out the last 2. The later die states of this variety can show a fine die crack from the edge through the bottom of star 12 to the bust.
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Jaobler's Avatar
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6384 Posts
 Posted 08/06/2009  03:51 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jaobler to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The elongated star points and the "horns" from the tips of the letters of UNITED are common effects of die wear. Flow effects from the pressure of the striking process causes die metal to flow outward (radially) and results in a progressive distortion of details at the coin edges.

I don't have an Overton book but it sounds like Ratman has it nailed.
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TreasHunt's Avatar
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 Posted 08/06/2009  06:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add TreasHunt to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Without checking, Ratman's logic seems sound.

FYI: It is not Overstamped.

The correct terminology is re-punched.
there is no such thing as over stamped, unless it is on an envelope, perhaps.

The individual devices were punched into the die, and if something was re-punched it is either re-punched, or, possibly over-punched.

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Jamez's Avatar
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750 Posts
 Posted 08/06/2009  08:02 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jamez to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It is indeed a O-111 R2 Coin.

You can see more about this coin at:
http://coinzip.proboards.com/index....&thread=1546

Nice pickup.
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Moe145's Avatar
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 Posted 08/06/2009  10:59 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Moe145 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well done, gentlemen and/or ladies!! Thank you!

Can anyone tell me a worthwhile reference book to help me with this in the future?

(I will be careful of my terminology in the future, as well! Note to self: Re-punched, not overstamped, got it!)

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Napoleon31ft's Avatar
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 Posted 08/06/2009  11:11 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Napoleon31ft to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The overton book is good. The only problem is that the older versions dont have reliable R factors.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
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23522 Posts
 Posted 08/06/2009  12:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Can anyone tell me a worthwhile reference book to help me with this in the future?


Early Half Dollar Die Varieties 1794-1836

This is the Overton book Napoleon31ft mentions, and Overton is the guy who's initial we're throwing around when we call your coin O-111.

Look for the Third Edition, published in 1990. There's a Fourth Edition, published by Don Parsley (Overton's son-in-law), but I've heard there are errors in it. Expect to pay $60-ish for the book, unless you get lucky.
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