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The Seven Topics Of VAMming That Merit No Discussion

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SsuperDdave's Avatar
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 Posted 12/17/2010  5:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I believe that you would first feel compelled to disclose everything and enlighten the prospective buyer prior to sale


....which is why I get my butt kicked upon resale at ebay so often. That's balanced by regular customers who look for my username; trouble is, they know what they're doing and won't overpay me.

I contend that not only can the dynamic be changed, but that change is inevitable and will tilt towards the collector. Every day it becomes more difficult to keep information "secret."

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 Posted 12/17/2010  6:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add zeewool to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
That's balanced by regular customers who look for my username; trouble is, they know what they're doing and won't overpay me.
I can only hope that those 'regulars' are collectors rather than dealers....(if not, then you are being played like an old violin)..


Quote:
Every day it becomes more difficult to keep information "secret."
And that is due to the efforts of the very few.....and it isn't always those who claim responsibility, or even have it bestowed upon them for something as superficial as updating the VAM pages....(when those pages evolve to become a viable tool toward variety identification that even a novice can use effectively, then will be the time for praise).....Things could move along a lot more quickly if all folks would all pitch in and supply standardized photos of these vams rather than just one picture of one feature, or no photo at all.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
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 Posted 12/17/2010  7:02 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I note they have been licensing images from HA lately, a huge step in the right direction.
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 Posted 12/17/2010  7:31 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add zeewool to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yeah, imagine how great it would be if that could be done with all vams.....It may then be the hobby of kings a hobby for collectors.
Edited by zeewool
12/17/2010 7:34 pm
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
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 Posted 12/17/2010  8:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Don't forget, even a trickle will some day fill an ocean.
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 Posted 12/17/2010  8:30 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add zeewool to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Yeah, eventually we will be at the "That's one small step for vammers.....(crackle, static, crackle)....and one giant step for vamkind".

Presently though, we are in the "Houston...we've got a problem" era.
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Morgans Dad's Avatar
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 Posted 12/17/2010  9:22 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgans Dad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply



" Don't forget, even a trickle will some day fill an ocean."

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

This is what I see running this hobby, I see those of greater wealth having the " home field advantage"!!! I sure would like an even playing field, just a thought from the silent minority........

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 Posted 12/17/2010  9:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add vumfinder to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The vamming elites establish the lists. They decide what is desirable and what isn't. You can bet the ones they have in invetory become the ones on the lists. And almost forgot, the make the price guide. A rigged game?
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twohawks's Avatar
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 Posted 12/17/2010  9:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add twohawks to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Not to seem like I have come off the wall. But all the Questions have merit, but when the day is done. No planning as far as a collector, or speculation will amount to anything.

As a collector we tend to look at everything waiting for the other shoe too drop. As I can only truly effect my action. So to me wondering what some dealers are planning or the way thing will turn out when Leroy V Allen passes. Just adds more stress!

Personalities Clash, Dealers are there to make a buck, Hype has been used for 100's of years to sell everything. So as a collector it comes down to a few things.

1) Why do I collect this stuff ?

2) If I am hoping for a long term investment "am I cool if it go's down"

3) If I lost 25% over time and enjoyed the collecting experience was it worth it?

4) How can I mitigate large devaluation of what I collect?

The only good answer to me is if, the answer too number (3) is NO you may not what to collect anything........ as all collectibles go up and down in value. If you buy right with some knowledge you very well could have a gain.

With that said it will always come down to BUYER BEWARE. Except the reason you collect, and work with it. The number of VAM collector's will go up and down, VAM or no VAM a coin is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. I collect VAM's so Vamming is real at least to 1 person. As far as coin collecting the numbers are down across the board I am to understand, but the numbers have gone up and down over the years and history tells us the number of hobbyists drops in harder financial times like now. Is it normal now? I do not know, but I collect and do not speculate.
Edited by twohawks
12/17/2010 9:41 pm
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
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 Posted 12/17/2010  11:57 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
What is your level of commitment? Does it have to happen soon enough to benefit you, or does it have to happen right the first time? What if the two are mutually incompatible?

Work towards the goal. Not your goal. It will happen. The end game is not in question; only the timing. Be faithful.
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Morgans Dad's Avatar
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5625 Posts
 Posted 12/18/2010  05:09 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Morgans Dad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
SD, I like you have amassed hundreds of Morgans/Peace dollars for my collection, I do collect for many reasons and like to study die progression etc.

I DO not sell my coins, I fill holes in albums and am trying to complete some type sets, along with your everyday Vams because I have learned to recognize certain die "foot-prints", and love to do some hunting and research on these elusive imperfections and oddities.

I liken the term COIN-FORENSICS to the VAM hobby, I enjoy the study of the passion We have come to enjoy, thanks to a few very dedicated people and some great reading material, I found another way to enjoy this hobby and take 'things into my own hands" and bring ALL this to a level which I have come to also have a fond passion for, WHY you might ask, because I like most collectors have a desire to learn/hunt, and when the day has come to another peaceful ending, I like to think I have learned just one more piece of information to aid my self in searching for a better understanding of the Vamming world, I also feel empowered to absorb knowledge, then go out and blend in with those who have a better understanding,some not, and HUNT for the coins, others might just pass over.........I do not usually buy coins already attributed, something along the lines of finding my own and then there is always the dollar value difference between the two, for some reason finding my own coins feels better than paying what people have come to do ALL of the above and cash in on, which they have every right to do, if you want to pay what is being asked.........

I find asking questions allows me to broaden my knowledge and when it comes to this hobby, or life in general, "having your guns loaded" is the way to go.......
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okiepb's Avatar
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1213 Posts
 Posted 12/18/2010  09:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add okiepb to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Another extremely interesting thread. I really appreciate all the education that I'm getting from all the folks that post here on this site and the VAM experts in particular.
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NGiles's Avatar
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527 Posts
 Posted 12/18/2010  8:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add NGiles to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think too often people get caught up int the business end of these questions and forget the main point. This is a hobby and it is supposed to be fun, that is why I do it, if I happen to make a few bucks along the way that just increases the excitement. From my perspective vamming has grown tremendously because of the joy of the hunt, I think it will continue to do so in the future.
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VAMsforMoney's Avatar
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220 Posts
 Posted 12/18/2010  8:56 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add VAMsforMoney to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
"These are the seven topics. Where is the hobby headed?"

I am not sure where the "hobby" is headed. The question itself is loaded. There are really two sides to Vamming from what I can tell. There are pure hobbiests, who collect and enjoy learning. The "other" side of Vamming is turning a coin for a profit. Can a hobbiest sell coins for a profit? Sure. Can someone who routinely sells VAMs for a profit also enjoy the hobby? Sure.

So which side of the "hobby" is referred to in asking the posted question? My question is rhetorical of course. But it seems there are two distinct views about Vamming. One from a hobbiest's point of view, and one from a profit taker's point of view.
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
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 Posted 12/18/2010  9:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice to have you with us, VAMsforMoney.

I don't think the questions themselves are preloaded for either point of view, but the reaction to them certainly is. They were written by one known to enjoy VAMming for the learning, and not the profit, which might be a hint.

We can expect that few of those in your second point of view will participate. It's in their best interest to disseminate as little information as possible. There are, of course, major exceptions to that type - Logan McKechnie, for instance, is an unabashed seller whose commitment to the betterment of the hobby can't be questioned.

I wonder if the "distinct views" about VAMming should be defined differently, between "selfish" and "altruistic" views.
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