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 Replies: 12 / Views: 2,217 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1283 Posts |
I decided to start a mid-grade set of Buffalo nickels. The only other album I've completed is the Dansco Lincolns 1909-2007 (with proof only S-mints). I have this thing about uniformity so I like the grades to be consistent. My Lincoln set is high grade (All XF or better brown 1909-1959) and the Memorial cents are all BU red. That project turned out to be a MONSTER to complete. So for this reason I thought I would take it easy and go with all VF's on the Buffalo nickels. Setting aside the funds for the key dates will be less of an issue, and thus make it more enjoyable. Plus on a whim I can probably walk in and fill tons of common date holes for very little money. Also I think Buffaloes keep more of their aesthetic appeal in mid grades than most other coins. But the thing is I have very little experience with them, and I think I remember hearing that they're tough to grade. Reason being there's a pretty wide range of strike qualities depending on the year and mint. Is this actually the case? Is there a uniform standard for determining a true, solid VF for all dates and mint marks? I'm also going to go to the PCGS photograde page so I at least have a baseline. Edit: And one last question. This time I would like to go with the tri-fold type album just to mix things up. I'm assuming that's OK with VF nickels? I will no longer have the issue with toning red coins. Edited by USArmyParatrooper
01/02/2011 8:27 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
952 Posts |
I personally like to use the official ANA grading standards book.....for instance, a VF is generally considered to be a full horn, but the strength of it can make it considered to be Vf-20 or VF-30. Going through the grading descriptions for the VF and XF coins will give you a great idea on whether or not the coin(s) you are looking at meet the grade or not. And as always, if you are set on making sure you have a min grade, make sure you either inspect them in person or buy somethnig that looks to be higher than VF from ebay, etc. I like looking in person....it's a lot more fun. There is some bigger variances in strike quality, and I will pass on something that I am not comfortable with as another coin of the same date/mm will pass my way sooner or later. Hope this helps. I have decided to put together a high grade folder myself.....trying to get all AU/BU coins but the 21-s, 24-s and 26-s might have to be lower grades due to the cost. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts |
Quote:
Edit: And one last question. This time I would like to go with the tri-fold type album just to mix things up. I'm assuming that's OK with VF nickels? I will no longer have the issue with toning red coins.
I think your are referring to Folders, not Albums. An Albums is normally a book shapped item with removable pages and slides over the coins. Also, front and rear visability. A folder is one where you push coins into a slot, no rear visability, folds like a folder. Normally you can easily push a coin into a slot in an Album with little effort. A person must push really hard to get most coins into slots in folders. 1. Pushing coins into a folder with your thumb may leave finger prints on the coins. 2. If you've ever seen coins with dark stripes on the reverse, those many have come from a folder. 3. There is no protection of touching a coin in a folder as with an Album 4. The rear of those folder slots are shinny due to the glue used to make them 5. Albums cost a lot more than Folders. 6. Air, moisture, gasses, foreign objects can damage coins in a folder. Eventually as your collection grows you may want to improve the grades of some of your Buffalo nickels and find a folder is just not the place for coins you like. |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1283 Posts |
Thanks, both of you. mdh, I'm out in CA now and I plan to visit the coin shop tomorrow. Unfortunately I don't have an ANA grading with me. I plan to pick up a bunch of common, and perhaps a few slightly better date examples. I guess what I'll do for now is look at a bunch of different graded VF examples online, and only pick up ones that look to be very strong VF coins. just_carl, I appreciate you pointing out the drawbacks - and yes I meant folders. I like folders better but I only have albums right now for better protection. I thought I might be safe with VF grade nickel. It sounds like I am still better off sticking to albums. It's too bad because I really like the presentation and the more personable feel of coin folders. Regardless, thanks for talking sense into me :) |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1080 Posts |
Not to pile on, but I HATE folders... a couple of years ago I sorted through my late grandfather's coins, and many very valuable pieces were RUINED by Dansco folders (the obverse was BU and the reverse was dark, dark mud colored). But I think the real reason NOT to use a folder for your Buffalo herd is because it hides the reverse from view. The reverse of the Buffalo nickel not only has the mint mark (which you will want to show off) but is probably more iconic than the obverse. I think this is definitely a set that you want to keep in a Dansco or Intercept Shield album. (If you want to have a folder just to "mix it up," you should do V nickels in an album. The reverses on many dates are weak struck anyway... the major grading of V nickels is from the obverse (Liberty's cap and hair) -- while Jeffersons and Buffaloes are graded heavily according to the reverse (Monticello pillars and steps, and buffalo horn, respectively) -- and only 2 coins have mintmarks that would make you want to inspect the reverse. You can probably assemble a V nickel set for about the same price as your buffalo herd... there are only 3 major key dates, there are fewer coins that the buffalo set, and you can easily get the consistent grade that you like in your collections.) |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1080 Posts |
and to add to Just_Carl's list, getting a coin OUT of a folder can be a real pain in the reverse.  And it often results in damaging the folder. It's also very important to me that my coins be aligned (no coins rotated this way or that way), and in an album I can see the reverse to line up the coin before I insert it (so I can line up the mound beneath the buffaloes, for instance). Best of luck whatever you decide. Buffaloes are a classic part of American coin collecting. Everyone should have a herd. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1283 Posts |
I'll just put it on record that I decided to stick to the albums.
mdh157, you mentioned that VF is generally considered full horn. I looked at several VF examples in PCGS holders, all of them look like they have the tips of the horns worn off. Are you sure on the full horn requirement?
Edited by USArmyParatrooper
01/03/2011 01:53 am
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Pillar of the Community
United States
6381 Posts |
My low-value Jefferson nickels left in a Whitman folder for years developed green corrosion around the rims. I wouldn't want that to happen with a much more valuable Buffalo set. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2602 Posts |
I thought a full horn was an EF?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
952 Posts |
When I get home this afternoon I will post the VF grading from the book verbatim.....and I know exactly what you guys mean because I've seen a lot of them graded VF but without the full horn showing. Not sure why there is such a discrepancy.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
952 Posts |
OK......these are the grading standards from the Official ANA Grading Standards book for VF Buffaloes - and I'm typing it verbatim. VF-20 (typical) Obverse: Hair and cheek show considerable flatness, but all details are clear. Feathers still show partial detail. Reverse: Hair on head is worn. Tail and point of horn are visible. VF-30 (Choice) Obverse: Hair shows nearly full details. Feathers and braid are worn but sharp. Reverse: Head, front leg and hip are worn. Tail shows plainly. Horn is worn but full. strange....but isn't the point of the horn the highest and thus the first to wear off? Now here's the variance - I've seen quite a few that are prof graded as VF-20 but the tip of the horn isn't visible. Looks like all of this is as clear as mud. |
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Valued Member
United States
149 Posts |
Sorry I'm a little late getting to this thread, but you have hit a nerve with me. I've been collecting Buffalos most of my life ( I'm old enough to remember them in circulation!), and they are extremely challenging to find one of each date/MM with a full horn! Twenty-to twenty five years ago, you didn't see that many dealers calling a non- full horn coin a VF or Xf, but they do now. My guess is that they realize how difficult it is to find some issues well struck, and with full horns, so they get market graded, which I don't agree with. Stick to your guns, and only buy the best, and you will have a nice set that you will be proud of. I will say this, IMO, this will be much, much, more difficult than your Lincoln collection to put together.You will see a lot of overgraded coins.By the way, the last one I bought to complete the set was the 24-s. That is a tough coin to find in true VF/Xf. Some dealers that I talk with mention the 14-d, but I didn't have too much trouble with that one. The 13-s II is another very tough coin to find in high circulated grades. It would be intersting to estimate how many of each date and MM actually survive due to the high relief nature of the design regarding premature wear on the date. Does anyone have an idea?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1283 Posts |
Quote:
From mdh157
strange....but isn't the point of the horn the highest and thus the first to wear off? That is exactly what I was thinking when I read that. And yes, from everything I've seen the tip is the first part of the horn to go. |
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Replies: 12 / Views: 2,217 |
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Posted 01/02/2011 8:43 pm
