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1921 S Poss. New VAMS? Need Help!

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Bryan1315's Avatar
United States
14454 Posts
 Posted 01/22/2011  2:38 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bryan1315 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I agree SuperDave would be the one on the forum that may be able to answer the attribution from the top of his head since he is the most knowledgeable person on anything 1921's I have ever seen. I don't have time right now but when I get back home tonight if there has been no responses I will try and help narrow it down for you

Quote:
I always thought that trails were caused by cleaning or the way the die was intially cut?

This is about the best explanation about the theory explaining die trails http://traildies.com/id51.html . I am not sure I agree with it in your coins case because it just doesn't make sense to me. If that is what a die trail is I am not sure we can call what we see on your coin die trails because yours doesn't look like it was doubnle struck in the die but rather the letters were deformed somehow and I have never seen anymore as drastic as yours and if it were in the die from creation I would think it would have started out that way and every coin struck by that particular die would look the same. So I have no idea what the correct term would be to describe what your coin exhibits but I am not convinced it should be called die trails by this description they explain on that site. BJ Neff is a well known error expert and he is the one who write that article so I am in no position to question his facts, I am just questioning he term used pertaining your coin
Valued Member
United States
60 Posts
 Posted 01/23/2011  3:18 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add OldFlabergeezer to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks so much Bryan, but now I'm really clueless! Out of thickness plantchet maybe?
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SsuperDdave's Avatar
United States
23522 Posts
 Posted 01/26/2011  10:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SsuperDdave to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My apologies for ignoring you, sir; it's tougher to go in sixteen directions at once than I first thought.

1921 San Francisco coins demonstrate these "horns" frequently. I've seen lesser versions of them on other Morgan issues, but 1921-S has taken it to a whole new level. I'm thinking it's a combination of lackadasical die alignment combined with pushing dies to their limit in order to produce enough coins.

Your first example is as extreme as I've ever seen it, and on the opposite side of the obverse die than normally found. It's usually at the bottom, most obviously the date. The obverse strike is really soft at the periphery - look at the dots either side of "E PLURIBUS" - and the stars look "drawn" to the rim, indicating a very worn die. Yet, the center of the die is strongly-struck - the intersection of hair and ear is the first place one sees a weak strike on the obverse, and this coin is sharply-detailed there.

Makes me wonder if these dies were more than normally convex, and if that was deliberate, knowing how many coins they would have to strike.
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aladinslamp's Avatar
United States
3076 Posts
 Posted 01/27/2011  12:52 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add aladinslamp to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I tried to research how many dies were produced or the 1921-s series. my book is old...but 500K per die seems a bit unrealistic.... but could explain such die fatigue abnormalities....
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