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 Replies: 14 / Views: 1,762 |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2602 Posts |
Like so many I greatly dislike what counterfeits are doing to the numismatic hobby.
So my worry is counterfeits will become such a huge problem, with counterfeits that are harder to detect, to the point that many people will leave the hobby disgusted because of being burned or scammed (especially new collectors, which is vital for the growth of the hobby). If enough people leave the hobby because of this, the bottom would drop out of coin-collecting and lead to free fall in coin prices.
Do I worry too much about this happening, or is this a real possiblity down the road?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2335 Posts |
I think it's a very real possibility. I've seen a similar thing happen over the years to US art pottery. There are so many fakes being churned out that people are very leery of buying anything. I'm not a specialist but have a couple pieces I bought to resell in my display case at the local antique mall. Even though I have had them authenticated by the local expert I haven't been able to sell.....not even at bargain basement prices.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3184 Posts |
your fears are the same I have. The chinese counterfeiters have done a thing with morgans that I am very afraid to buy raw junk morgans (unsure if real or fake as the chinese make thousands of them daily!). We shall see in the next few year what transpires....
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Pillar of the Community
United States
3276 Posts |
if your fears are so great then just spend the extra money on slabbed coins. yes these can be faked too but there is a must less chance of it. also you can take your coins to someone who knows there stuff to help find out if they are genuine. just be careful where and from who you are buying. find reputable dealers in coin stores and on ebay. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10045 Posts |
Seeing how the quality of forgeries has vastly improved, I've wondered the same recently; how good will the fakes get? And what should be the TPG's role in curtailing the flood of fake slabs? Reference photos may help there. Still, I cannot wrap my mind around "authenticating" a TPG's slab, yet it may come to that for internet buyers. I have already spotted fakes of Scandinavian coins, but since I specialize in overdates, I'm good with small details already.  Bring it on, fakers-- I dare ya.   |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
Yes there is a fair possibility that the counterfeits will drive out enough collectors to crash the market and cause prices to fall. Then the hobby will go back to being a hobby again peopled by specialists willing to do the study to be able to recognize the genuine pieces themselves. And prices will be low enough that even if they make the occasional error they will not get hurt badly.
And when it happens I will be able to get the coins I need easier and more cheaply.
Edited by Conder101
06/15/2011 3:08 pm
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Valued Member
United States
309 Posts |
Yep, I'm with conder101 on this. Drop some prices and I can get some sweet deals. :-) Aside; fakery is how ANACS got started and diligent collectors/investors will overcome (probably with the help of TPG's). Besides, I think TPG's should be more willing to just authenticate a coin anyway, whether it has been cleaned or not, for a smaller price. Leave the grading up to buyers. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
880 Posts |
Your sweet deals wont exactly be sweet deals at that point though. If it bottoms out it wont recover ;/
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1348 Posts |
Quote:
Leave the grading up to buyers Couldn't agree more! Charge less and leave it to us to determine value and rarity. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
10045 Posts |
 There is no absolute grading standard anyway; eye appeal and personal opinion are a large part. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1064 Posts |
I agree with conder, to some extent; I have a dozen or so coins I bought on ebay '97-'98, and at the time I didn't even THINK about counterfeits! Now, I've read so much, and seen a lot of discussion here on CCF, I feel I must become proficient in determining their authenticity and grade myself, rather than my usual trust-sellers-with-high-numbers attitude, take some responsibility for myself. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts |
Your fears are well founded. Just one of the reason's some other hobbies fell. Beanie Babies too were hit with massive fakes selling for a few dollars. No one really knows who or how many of those sporting cards were real. My son used to buy boxes of them for $5 per 5000. Wonder where those were made.
Coins too are and have been for a while now counterfeited. Much more so than most would imagine. And some are so good, many dealers too are fooled. One I know purchased a 16D Merc he swore was real but turned out a fake.
I wonder just how many dealers and collectors have counterfeit coins, couterfeit slabs with fake coins inside and don't know. I always remember a dealer that showed me a really silly slab he had opened, changed the coin to something really off and resealed it to the point I oouldn't tell. And the China people are smart enough to use real metals since they are selling the coins as collectables.
I wonder too just how many foreign coins are beeing faked too. We here always bring up our coins being faked, but I wonder if that is going on everywhere.
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
17884 Posts |
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Your sweet deals wont exactly be sweet deals at that point though. If it bottoms out it wont recover So what, the serious hobby collectors are into it because they love the coins and we really don't care if we get our money back out of them. The lower prices will allow us to buy coins we would never otherwise hope to get. Quote:
I wonder too just how many foreign coins are beeing faked too. We here always bring up our coins being faked, but I wonder if that is going on everywhere. Carl, do you remember those pictures of dies shown in the pictures of the Chinese counterfeiting mint from About.com that keeps being reposted every few months. If you see those pictures again take a good look at them. Most of the dies are for World coins not US coins. I have pictures of hundreds of fake world coins made by the counterfeiter who keeps giving all the information to Coin World. |
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Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts |
Quote:
So what, the serious hobby collectors are into it because they love the coins and we really don't care if we get our money back out of them. The lower prices will allow us to buy coins we would never otherwise hope to get.
Exactly how I feel. I never even thought of a counterfeited coin until they are blasted all over the internet. I've been collecting coins for well over 60 years now and although I'm now more watchful, I let the fakes just float on by. Quote:Carl, do you remember those pictures of dies shown in the pictures of the Chinese counterfeiting mint from About.com that keeps being reposted every few months. If you see those pictures again take a good look at them. Most of the dies are for World coins not US coins. I have pictures of hundreds of fake world coins made by the counterfeiter who keeps giving all the information to Coin World. Good point. I never paid to much attemtion to those. Guess everyone is being hit with this counterfeiting craze. |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
2602 Posts |
Well, I'm hoping that as counterfeits get more sophisticated, so too, does our ability to detect these fakes, to keep ourselves ahead of the game. I agree that one must be vigilant in learning about coins so that you can spot problems leading you to think it is a fake- examples include knowledge of where the mint mark should be in relation to the 1909 on the 1909-S VDB Lincoln Cent, and the knowledge that an authentic 14-D cent has no VDB initials by the shoulder. These examples come from knowing the coins you are buying and not buying things blindly. Keep the comments coming! |
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Replies: 14 / Views: 1,762 |
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Posted 06/15/2011 1:38 pm
