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Are There Any 'Impossible' Series In US Coins?

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maudry's Avatar
Luxembourg
588 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  4:39 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add maudry to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Maybe this question has been asked before, but I was wondering if money was not a problem, were there any series impossible to complete?

I know there's probably no series possible to achieve in MS70 , but if you were not looking for the grade, how long would it take to get all coins?

There's the Liberty nickel from 1913 and the St. Gaudens from 1933 but at least the nickels are appearing on a regular basis in auctions.
It should not take much longer than a week to complete the Lincolns or similar series, even in MS - there are so many traders that are specialized into these.

Are there any coins that did not appear in the market for lets say the last 5 to 10 years?

The other question of course would be, did anyone ever achieve this? And what's the cash needed to do it?
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unholyroller's Avatar
United States
1903 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  5:25 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add unholyroller to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The term "series" and "complete" are totally subjective terms.
You say Lincoln cents would be easy to do. You are right if say you wanted all the varieties of standard steel wartime cents. That would consist of three, very easily done. Now add in known error varieties and your challenge grows to "doubled d", a bit harder to get done. Next level.....mistakes like a 1944 or 1944d steel, they weren't supposed to be made but they were, if this still fits your "steel wartime" cents the challenge grow again. Do bronze 43 cents count? This could be an error of a 43 steel depending on your view...now the possibility of your quest grows even more unlikely. Now add in all the experimental planchet types the government played around with in 1943 until they settled on the zinc/steel cent and you run into a wall where not all the variations can be had due to not existing anymore. So as you can see depending on how you define a "series" can make or break it being possible or not
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Moe145's Avatar
United States
8904 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  5:50 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Moe145 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The 1878 S Seated Liberty half dollar is a rare one. The books state 12,000 minted but a LARGE majority (no one really knows how high the percentage) were immediately melted.

That's why the 2012 RedBook lists the 1878 S SL Half Dollar in G-4 grade, at $21,000.

Wow!
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United States
1590 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  5:55 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jmkendall to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't think any series is impossible. Didn't Q.David Bowers assemble a set every series ever made by the US Mint?

I think it fair to say that several sets are limited. Such as the Liberty nickel and 1933 St Gaudens you mentioned. Barber dimes come to mind. Stellas.

On the other hand there might be one set that, from a purely technical viewpoint, might be impossible to do. That would be the Peace dollar. Because Technically the Mint did make a 1964 Peace dollar. Not a trial Strike, not a pattern, but a regular production coin. They just never released it. Yeah, yeah, I know it is a technicality, but; real none the less!
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D0ubl3Eagle's Avatar
United States
5854 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  6:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add D0ubl3Eagle to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I believe that it was Louis Eliasberg who put together a complete set of u.s coins. A couple of series that I can think of off the top of my head that are near impossible to complete are Seated half dimes, three dollar gold, early capped bust half eagles, and St. Gaudens depending of the outcome of the Langboard case.
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GTALLEN's Avatar
United States
315 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  6:19 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add GTALLEN to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
"Louis E. Eliasberg, Sr. (1896--1976) was an American financier and numismatist. He is best known in the numismatic community for putting together the only complete collection of United States coins ever assembled.[1] Although the set was not truly "complete" by modern standards (for instance, it did not differentiate between proofs and circulation strikes, as most modern collectors and set registries do), it is still the most comprehensive U.S. numismatic collection of all time."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Eliasberg

I would say a complete collection of US coins to include proofs and circulation coinage would be impossible. Regardless, of how deep your pockets are.
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GTALLEN's Avatar
United States
315 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  6:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add GTALLEN to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Also there are coins that are unobtainable at any price. This article by PCGS names a few.

http://www.pcgs.com/Articles/Detail/1775
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  7:10 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Continuing what unholyroller was indicating, with Lincoln Cents alone if you started with all the massive varieties and error coins, it's possible. HOWEVER, using coppercoins books on that coin tends to discuss an error coin for almost every year. People mention the 43 Copper, 44 Steel, 59 Wheat back and on and on. Then too most just mention the 55 and 72 Double Dies. Now start with all the double Mint marks (RPM), throw in the date over date, off centers, lamination errors and on and on you find you would need a large warehouse just for all the Lincoln Cents.
And that Link by GTALLEN only mentions a few coins. Look on pages 414 to 418 of the 2012 Red Book and you'll see 250 coins that all start in the hundreds of thousand dollar ranges. And I'm sure many of those are not ever going to be for sale unless the owner passes away.
As to a really complete set of any thing, the Chinese will soon enough make that possible for any coin.
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nohope587's Avatar
United States
5953 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  7:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nohope587 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've been working on my series for the last 15 years or so and I'm less than half complete and that's with amassing several thousand coins...I doubt I will complete it in my lifetime It won't be trough lack of trying..
Several coins require some one to die and the family to decide to sell the estate...
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VisigothKing's Avatar
United States
4778 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  7:21 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add VisigothKing to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
That's why the 2012 RedBook lists the 1878 S SL Half Dollar in G-4 grade, at $21,000.

Wow!
I second that wow!
Rest in Peace
biggfredd's Avatar
United States
9104 Posts
 Posted 08/27/2011  8:36 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add biggfredd to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
There are several unique or two made gold pieces. The 1910vdb is incredibly rare.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 08/28/2011  10:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The 1910vdb is incredibly rare.

where is this noted? In coppercoins book on Lincoln Cents he mentions that this is only a rumor and NONE have ever been authenticated. Would be interesting to read about this one.
Back to the original post. Does that also include all commemoratives? Post Colonial issues?
Edited by just carl
08/28/2011 10:47 am
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maudry's Avatar
Luxembourg
588 Posts
 Posted 08/28/2011  1:37 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add maudry to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks for the answers so far. Some very interesting information so far.
I did on purpose not give more precision about the definition of a set as I wanted to have as much input as possible.

Personally I don't think trial strikes with a different motive or different alloy than the one finally used for circulation are necessary for a complete set but they are a nice addition to an otherwise complete set.
Same for errors, double dies, etc. unless they have been widely accepted (for what reason?) by collectors.

More opinions and background information are welcome.


Quote:
Does that also include all commemoratives? Post Colonial issues?

I don't look at NCC as coins but the other ones could be included. Idem for Post Colonial issues where I believe there are incredibly rare issues.
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littleboy's Avatar
United States
764 Posts
 Posted 08/28/2011  9:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add littleboy to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
i dont think any series would be impossible to complete. lets say there is one date/mint mark/variety that is impossible to get ahold of. then it wouldnt exist. in that case it wouldnt be part of the series. sure, some unique pieces exist that reside in the smithsonian or other museums, but it is possible for someone to make a deal with the museum for something more desirable to showcase, or simply break in and steal it.
Bedrock of the Community
United States
20753 Posts
 Posted 08/29/2011  09:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
or simply break in and steal it.


Possibly the easiest and most cost effective method.
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oih82w8's Avatar
United States
7840 Posts
 Posted 08/29/2011  10:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add oih82w8 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I would second the STELLAS ($4 gold pieces), there were four versions made over two years; 1879 & 1880 (coiled and flowing hair), and would dang near impossible to complete.


$4 Gold Stellas

1879 Flowing Hair
-- -- -- 68,750 87,500 96,880 100,000 105,630 110,630 118,750
1879 Coiled Hair
-- -- -- 106,250 118,750 143,750 146,880 150,000 156,250 162,500
1880 Flowing Hair
-- -- -- 87,500 109,380 125,000 128,130 131,250 134,380 139,380
1880 Coiled Hair
-- -- -- 237,500 268,750 318,750 325,000 331,250 343,750 362,500


http://numismedia.com/fmv/prices/4g...icesgd.shtml
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