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Replies: 1,517 / Views: 102,439 |
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Pillar of the Community
2224 Posts |
You will still have a set (raw or graded, opened or sealed) with mintage figures of somewhere around 250K plus/minus .... that's low in my book. As an ASE collector and admirer I want it in my collection. 
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2764 Posts |
I received my 2 set of PCGS PF70 Multiholder from Silvertowne. Both PF coins have planchet flaws under 10x loupe and one even have tiny contact marks.
Have anyone have similar problems? Did you request an exchange/replacement? How did Silvertowne handle the situation?
My concern is that since they sold-out of the coin sets, they may not have any left and I'll be force to get a refund. What about PCGS guarantee of grade (or purchase the coin at market price)? I thought I've read somewhere about this guarantee.
Edited by SA4H 09/04/2012 8:24 pm
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Valued Member
 United States
301 Posts |
I thought a MS/PF70 coin was perfect under 5x magnification, not 10x. Does anyone know?
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote: Have anyone have similar problems? Did you request an exchange/replacement? How did Silvertowne handle the situation?
I can almost guarantee you wont get a replacement. Theyre sold out and have been for quite some time. Pretty much every where I've checked recently besides ebay is sold out at any price. But like Mach said I'm pretty sure that they use 5x, thats what I've heard anyway. Youll find flaws in every one of them if you look with a strong enough loupe. I would keep them or sell them if it really bothered you but if that was my only set, Id keep it
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Valued Member
United States
194 Posts |
I got two "70" replacements, each from 2 different companies, and although both are better (notably the PCGS RP doesn't have a big milk spot on the sun device), both RPs have easily noticed tics (tiny scratches in the frosty field). Forget about under power. What a shame both TPGs have decided to lower standards like this. If someday premiums shoot through the roof, I'll bet the 70s will be scrutinized vis a vis CAC green oval for the top dollar examples, and the others will be considered like the over-graded Binion dollars.
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Valued Member
United States
110 Posts |
Quote:
I got two "70" replacements, each from 2 different companies, and although both are better (notably the PCGS RP doesn't have a big milk spot on the sun device), both RPs have easily noticed tics (tiny scratches in the frosty field). Forget about under power. What a shame both TPGs have decided to lower standards like this. If someday premiums shoot through the roof, I'll bet the 70s will be scrutinized vis a vis CAC green oval for the top dollar examples, and the others will be considered like the over-graded Binion dollars.
...I don't think CAC does ASE? I got 3 sets sent in the first shipment and ALL 3 RP's looked like I found them in a dead homeless man's pocket. The proofs were ALL flawless, but since I like the RP better, I sent them back, called and complained for 30+ min and went as high up on the ladder as I could complaining, complaining & complaining... I got 3 replacements sent and they were shipped before the PCGS FS cutoff; SEALED they will stay. As far as I'm concerned, I will appreciate them more sealed from the mint via PBGS... If I opened them, I could get super mad due to quality and then if I sent them back, there would be no point in my ordering early to have the option for FS. So in the end, I'll keep this thing for many years unopened and still a mystery. It's the only option I have for me to be satisfied, I look at it like a $500 bet, at least this package, cause I will never open it or send it to PCGS. I guess what I am saying is that I was put in the position of keeping 3 sets (unopened) that I wanted to rip open the second I got them and send to PCGS for grading. I have two more shipments coming (2 sets Sept & 2 sets Oct), so I will open those and if they are good, I will happily keep them, if not back they go for a refund and to lesson the total mintage  Erik
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1027 Posts |
Quote: PBGS has been messing up orders lately. The box that was supposed to contain my 5 uncirculated ASEs only had one coin in it. The FedEx weight for it was 8 ounces, less than the weight of five coins in their blue boxes alone (11 ounces)... When you are shorted, you have to fill out a "Certification of Non-Receipt", FAX or mail it in, and wait 4 to 6 weeks for "review and processing" in the meantime, I am out the money for the four coins I haven't received... Today I got an email saying the 4 missing coins had been received as a return and my money refunded. The original track order page now shows 5 shipped, 4 returned and 4 more ordered and in stock and reserved. They may be slow but at least they are getting the job done without any hassles. The only thing that bugs me is that they don't really acknowledge the mistake. By booking the mixup as a return they sidestep the fact that they messed up and shipped one coin and claimed it was five. I find this failure to admit fallibility a little disturbing. Hopefully, when the four coins ship, the FedEx shipper will say that the package weighs more than the one that contained "five" coins. So far, my CC account only has the new charge for the 4 "replacement" coins but does not yet have the credit for the ones that did not ship before so I am, for the moment, out for nine coins but only have one.
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Valued Member
United States
194 Posts |
Well, I spoke too soon. I had time last night to look over the reverse, and there's a milk spot on the shield, as well as a tiny nick in the rim. This is a PCGS 70 RP, and it would be my second return to the vendor. (That makes three PF70 RPs I've bought from PCGS with milk spots.) I'm out $15 shipping for the last return... What would you do?
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1027 Posts |
It is probably time to contact PCGS directly and ask them if the spots would have prevented them assigning a 70 in the first place and if so, what can a collector do about spots that develop in the slab. I don't think that a tiny rim nick would affect the grade of any coin, especially as ASE. In any case, you should probably ask for some relief on the costs you have encountered returning coins that were less than advertised. A good vendor should make at least some effort to send you coins that don't have the issues that you returned the first ones for. There are those who simply want the label to say perfect (PR70) and then there are those, like you, who truly want perfect coins for their collections. You are paying for perfection and there is no reason that you should not get it. I would be willing to bet that if the folks at PCGS re-examined the coins you have returned, they would say that they are still PR70 specimens. That would happen either because they are not willing to admit fault or because the coins really do still meet their criteria for the grade. PCGS might have images of the coins that were taken when they were graded and if so, could tell if the spots have become visible since the coins were slabbed or if they were there when graded. Let us know how things proceed. If you return the coin, be sure to make it clear why you are returning it and ask the vendor make the effort to select a coin that does not have any spots for you.
Edited by clairhardesty 09/05/2012 11:26 am
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Quote:...I don't think CAC does ASE? They dont. They dont do anything modern. Quote: By booking the mixup as a return they sidestep the fact that they messed up and shipped one coin and claimed it was five. I find this failure to admit fallibility a little disturbing And I'm sure thats how itll be counted in their stats as a return and not a mix up come time to renew their contract Quote: What would you do? I agree with clair a tiny nick on the rim doesn't really mean anything on an ASE. Either keep sending them back or just sell them and be done with the series and then yell at the mint for not knowing how to wash planchets. On a series not I dunno what Id do since I cant see your coins. If its a tiny nick you have to really hunt for id keep it.
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Valued Member
United States
194 Posts |
Thanks Claire, I will update with results. I appreciate the heads-up about the rim nick. I'm not as concerned about that as the milk spots. And for the record the CAC sticker was tongue in cheek ;)
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Bedrock of the Community
13014 Posts |
Lol clint. Can't imagine how frustrated you must be with the set. It seems everyone has the one set where no matter what they just can't catch a break on the quality.
If it helps I've contacted pcgs in the past about a milk spot and their policy at the time anyway was to resend it and if it downgrades their buy back comes into affect. Not sure how much they'd give, might be easier to try with where you bought them
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Valued Member
United States
218 Posts |
I got a PCGS set PF 70 under 10X mag.. there are all kinds of breaks in the frost and light contact marks on RP. reg proof is flawless . Got a NGC PF 69 set that IMHO should have been a 70 .So the TPG are in fact just human I guess no one see the same coin the same way TPG included
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Valued Member
United States
194 Posts |
On the milky RP, the vendor told me they are out of 70 RPs, and any future ones they get would not be ER/FS. They would take mine back, but I don't want to go backwards any further (loss of postage both ways). I imagine PCGS response would be as hypothesized above, so I will probably forego that. I had hoped to get a set I'd be happy to look at, long into the future, but now I'm pretty disgusted. To me, this quality control scenario between the mint and the TPGs is worse than the customer service issues surrounding the 2011 A25 set. I may just sell them and bail out on the series.
Oh, to recap, I've had in hand 5 different RPs graded 70. All have noticeable tics in the frost, some worse than others, of course. All 3 from PCGS had milk spots: 2 on the obverse sun device, 1 in the middle of the shield on the reverse. I hope the future is kind to NGC plastic...
Edited by Clint 09/05/2012 6:04 pm
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Pillar of the Community
United States
2764 Posts |
Base on the few responds.... I guess I should keep/sell mine rather than get an exchange.....?
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Replies: 1,517 / Views: 102,439 |