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Replies: 68 / Views: 16,743 |
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Valued Member
Canada
50 Posts |
"So does anyone who met the gentleman know why he did it? or if anyone has seen the cleaned coins, how exactly he cleaned them?"
First off Heritage underestimated the extent of damage to this collection apparently giving me their preliminary assessment before PCGS had regraded the coins.
Out of 547 lots approximately 100 coins are designated cleaned/no grade comprising almost 20% of the coins.
I was told by a dealer who I have known since childhood that George told him he used VIM a common bathroom cleaner to clean the coins. This substance does not get rid of the toning on coins but does make parts of them shiny. According to this dealer George also told him that he used VIM to clean the 1911 Dollar. That would explain to me why the toning looks the same but suddenly various distractions in the Obverse field are more highlighted causing the coin to be downgraded to Specimen 64. Because the toning patterns are the same PCGS did not designate the coin cleaned but likely they assumed George had mishandled the coin. George had a reputation for being very arrogant and certainly demonstrated his ignorance of numismatics with the comment of referring to a very desirable off center mint error as "garbage". Off Center mint errors on higher denominations are especially desirable. I had a very unpleasant encounter with this man when he was worried that I would try to reacquire the 1936 dot cent at the 2010 Canadiana sale at Heritage Auctions. I now regret that I did not acquire it as it too was downgraded by PCGS where they simply assumed that the Lacquer had been removed.
Edited by Sid Belzberg 06/08/2019 10:33 am
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1463 Posts |
this thread is so interesting. frustrating to learn someone would carry on in such a way vim bathroom cleaner Geesh!
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1442 Posts |
Good God...VIM...I have no words 
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Valued Member
Canada
194 Posts |
sad for these wonderful canadiana coin!
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Moderator
  Canada
10449 Posts |
"Discovery follows discovery, each both raising and answering questions, each ending a long search, and each providing the new instruments for a new search." -- J. Robert OppenheimerContent of this post is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 3.0 Unported License. See: http://creativecommons.org/licenses...0/deed.en_USMy eBay store
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1207 Posts |
I'm guessing PCGS doesn't recognize a specimen for 1884 yet or is there another reason for it not to be included in Rob's complete specimen set. Was the original designation by NGC correct?
Cheers, Bill
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1979 Posts |
SPP that juxtaposition of photographs is pretty stunning. They don't look like the same coin at all.
It will also be interesting to see the juxtaposition of the selling prices. I am going to guess that the price goes down by well over 50%....maybe 90%?. I wonder if PCGS would have even been able to positively identify this as a specimen if they did not know its provenance?
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1979 Posts |
I see now that the PCGS holder does not say specimen. The unenhanced photo makes the coin look absolutely awful. I think the seller will be lucky to get 10% of what h e paid.
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New Member
Canada
24 Posts |
Searching the Heritage website for "George Cook" there appears to be 528 lots thus far.
Searching for "George Cook Genuine" returns 160 lots in search results. That's 30% of lots that have an issue as identified by PCGS.
Ugh.
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5273 Posts |
Cleaned or not , played or messed with, whatever . Look at the strong bids on a lot of the coins already . When this stuff goes live at the ANA next week , looks like the Cook Family Will not be starving . As I said earlier a lot of the coins are still going to bring " Stupid Money" .
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1489 Posts |
The victorian dimes and most quarters seem to be going pretty strong. Missed the pennies and nickles, stupid work! Am I wrong on this or was it an obv 2? https://coins.ha.com/itm/canada/can...dLots-101116I keep looking at the eye as a marker with the gap, could not get a clear read off other markers, if yes, someone got a pretty sweet deal. Next time... Still surprised at all the unattributed hairlines and questionable issues with some of the coins. Any bets that some of the "Details" coins will end up at ICCS?
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5460 Posts |
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Pillar of the Community
Canada
1489 Posts |
Thanks Okie, what are you using as a marker? I keep looking at the gap where the upper and lower eyelids join. If I am reading correctly, Charleston's obv 4 is touching. Not sure if the double chin was a lighting issue.
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
1299 Posts |
Smooth, rounded chin and larger truncation detail - obverse 4.
http://www.victoriancent.com2011 & 2025 Fred Bowman Award Winner, 2020 J. Douglas Ferguson Award Winner, & 2022 Paul Fiocca Award Winner. Life Member of RCNA.
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Pillar of the Community
 Canada
5460 Posts |
As Rob says (and what I've gone by for 40 years), look at the chin/throat. Obv 2 & 3 both have a very visible dimple/indent. Obv 1 & 4 have a smooth, rounded chin/throat. You can tell a 2 from a 3 by the crossbar on the E's on the Obv ... 2's are normal/short and the 3's are very large/long. The Obv 4 is also known as the "mumps" portrait because her cheeks fat and puffy.
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Replies: 68 / Views: 16,743 |
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