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1941 LWC Ragged Clip And Huge Lamination Error On Reverse!

 
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Pillar of the Community
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507 Posts
 Posted 09/15/2019  12:33 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add Sarge50 to your friends list Get a Link to this Message



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 Posted 09/15/2019  12:38 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add moxking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
That ragged edge does not appear to have been caused at the mint.

Reverse look more like a strike through.
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 Posted 09/15/2019  03:01 am  Show Profile   Check spruett001's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add spruett001 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
First, that is not a clip, but damage. The extra indentations creeping into the coin's field give it away. Also, there is no evidence of any Blakesley Effect.

However, that is a very nice peeled lamination on the reverse. You can see a line extending northeast from it that continues the "peel." It's not a struck-through error.

I feel like the entire community needs some sort of class in identifying lams. It seems so simple, yet they are misidentified here often.
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Edited by spruett001
09/16/2019 02:36 am
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 Posted 09/15/2019  04:36 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am on the fence,leaning towards struck through.It would be nice if the photos were more in focus though.
John1
( I'm no pro, it's just my humble opinion )
Searched 5+ Million Cents Since 1971
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 Posted 09/15/2019  07:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Seems like we may not get consensus on this one. I am firmly on team lam for this one. The continuation of the lam edge up through the N in ONE is what does it for me.
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29518 Posts
 Posted 09/15/2019  07:29 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
So would it be a de-lam or a lam?
John1
( I'm no pro, it's just my humble opinion )
Searched 5+ Million Cents Since 1971
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 Posted 09/15/2019  07:54 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CoinTheTerm to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
What do you guys make of the rim on the obverse at the K9 position, lettering or memorial?
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 Posted 09/15/2019  09:06 am  Show Profile   Check Errers and Varietys's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add Errers and Varietys to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice Delamination!
More information about Die Deterioration? http://goccf.com/t/317950
Retired U.S. Mint Coin Die Set information. http://goccf.com/t/302961
Machine Doubling Tutorial. http://goccf.com/t/332421
Die states progression on coins. Scroll down, so you can see the different die state progressions. http://goccf.com/t/325638
Die Deterioration Doubling Tutorial. http://goccf.com/t/336470
Split Plate Doubling Tutorial. http://goccf.com/t/357614
2000 P LMC With Retained Struck Through error. http://goccf.com/t/357080
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 Posted 09/15/2019  09:07 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add John1 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
What do you guys make of the rim on the obverse at the K9 position, lettering or memorial?
Just PMD.
John1
( I'm no pro, it's just my humble opinion )
Searched 5+ Million Cents Since 1971
Edited by John1
09/15/2019 09:08 am
Pillar of the Community
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 Posted 09/15/2019  10:54 am  Show Profile   Check GrapeCollects's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add GrapeCollects to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Rim damage and a strike through for me
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 Posted 09/15/2019  10:54 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Greasy Fingers to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
with John1 ....see rim damage also on obverse @ 10k, making reverse damage PMD + lam/delam
Edited by Greasy Fingers
09/15/2019 10:55 am
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 Posted 09/15/2019  10:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Coinfrog to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm in the strike-through camp, with PMD to the rim.
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 Posted 09/15/2019  11:46 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sarge50 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Delamination- Cool, another new term! I'm researching what that is as well as searching ragged clip pictures to see what to look for, thanks guys!
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 Posted 09/15/2019  4:32 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add stoneman227 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The anomaly on the reverse is a lam , or more accurately said , the coin metal has delaminated. The cross striations in that area are the key to the ID. You can also see where it continues as a retained lam to the north.
TB found a coin here http://goccf.com/t/353442&SearchTerms=Lamination , that sparked a similar debate. His coin also had a retained area to the north. The telltale to ID the error on his coin was also in the anomaly but on his coin they indicated a struck through. The lines in the anomaly on TB's coin are not the striations of the internal structure of a planchet that has come apart as we see on Sarge's coin but roller lines from a part of the planchet that was protected by a strip of coin metal that was struck through.
Pillar of the Community
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 Posted 09/15/2019  7:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Willburton to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nailed it, stoneman
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 Posted 09/16/2019  02:48 am  Show Profile   Check spruett001's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add spruett001 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
So would it be a de-lam or a lam?


That's partly why this is tricky. The coin in question is "supposed" to be a solid alloy. That means no natural lines of separation. However, when metals are not combined properly, something akin to woodgrain can develop. The metal may separate along these lines and they are usually straight and directional just like wood grain.

So, the coins are not intended to have any laminate properties at all, but they happen (especially in the '40s!). Delam or lam, flaw, peel, error, etc...it all points to the same thing. Although LWCs are not laminated, I suppose "delamination" would be the most appropriate word to describe the way in which the metal separated.
Tantum religio potuit suadere malorum.
-Lucretius

"Just because you're paranoid don't mean they're not after you."
-Kurdt Kobain

My Want List: http://goccf.com/t/282022
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