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Will Ours Be Worth Anything?

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Valued Member

United States
462 Posts
 Posted 04/27/2012  10:36 am Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add KisNap to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Back in the late 1880's early 1900's I doubt there were a lot of coin collectors mostly due to the coin values being worth more. Today those coins are valuable 1) because of their silver content and 2) because a lot didn't survive. They also didn't mass produce mint sets specifically for collectors and as novelties.

My question is do you think, decades from now the more current coins we collect in our albums will command any sort of premium such as that?

A good example is:

1911 Liberty nickel: Mintage 39,559,372 MS-63 $138
2009-P Jefferson nickel: Mintage 39,840,000 MS-63 $0.48

Same comosition, similar mintage numbers.

Unless people pop their uncirculated coins out of the mint sets and spend them I can't imagine our current day coins ever being worth anything. What's your thought?

Ever think
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wquinn's Avatar
United States
2295 Posts
 Posted 04/27/2012  11:19 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wquinn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I doubt the modern clad coins (after 1964) will ever really go up much in value, other than the increase due to inflation. There are a few here and there, that will increase faster than inflation, but most will never, since so many millions were saved as BU.

Plus, we have nice containers, safes, deposit boxes, holders, etc now. There were none, back then, or anything available was primitive, 100 years ago, so saving them was very, very difficult. Plus with all of the hard times the country went through, back then, many were spent or lost.

If numismatics does take a big surge in popularity, then it might be possible, for some general ones to go up in value above inflation, if the demand increases for them.

Just because they go up, due to inflation, doesn't necessarily mean, they go up in value to make a larger profit. For example, if a BU State Quarter is worth a dollar and a loaf of bread costs $1, if in 5 years, the same BU quarter is worth $2, but also a loaf of bread costs $2, have you really made a profit if you sell the State Quarter for $2? According to the IRS you do, but not compared to other items. You just stayed even with inflation.
Edited by wquinn
04/27/2012 11:21 am
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Mechman's Avatar
United States
275 Posts
 Posted 04/27/2012  11:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Mechman to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Kis
I think that what you say is true. I also think that it all boils down to what people value. Values change. There was a time when people paid good money for a "Pet Rock"
Will you make a killing from your investment probably not. Did you enjoy collecting the coins? They are a part of history. If collecting is important to allot of people then your investment won't be in wasted. Time will tell.
Just me spouting off

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wquinn's Avatar
United States
2295 Posts
 Posted 04/27/2012  11:26 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wquinn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
A good example is:
1911 Liberty nickel: Mintage 39,559,372 MS-63 $138
2009-P Jefferson nickel: Mintage 39,840,000 MS-63 $0.48

I don't think that is a comparable example, because quite a few 1911 nickels were either worn out or lost/destroyed. And most were never saved, since there weren't many collectors back then.

Most 2009-P nickels are still sitting in Federal Reserve vaults and haven't even circulated yet. And today, most collectors are quite active and educated about the mintage by the time they were released. Also, they can afford to save a few rolls, when they find them. Most of these nickels will be saved for decades. Maybe once the inheritors get them, they will just spend them for face value and they will become more rare in the distant future (50 years from now)?
Edited by wquinn
04/27/2012 11:27 am
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nod2003's Avatar
United States
3294 Posts
 Posted 04/27/2012  11:40 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add nod2003 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Also, since a nickel could actually buy things back then, they circulated. Most change today goes from a bank, to a store to a customer, to their change jar and sits in the jar for a year or two before going back to the bank. Nickel velocity is way, way lower now then 100 years ago and as such, the nickels won't wear nearly as fast and more will remain in pristine condition.
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Jayman931's Avatar
United States
2651 Posts
 Posted 04/27/2012  3:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Jayman931 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
No one collected back then. Poeple are collecting now so they now have a collectors value. Supply and Demand. If people all of a sudden stopped collecting coins...the price on that 1911 nickel would drop. 2009's and any year will be collectible and have value in the future because the demand from collectors obviously is there. However there will be alot more of them so the prices will not be as high IMO. You might have to start going to the High Graded coins to get to that kind of premium as there will not be as many with high grades. Supply vs Demand.
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SilverEye's Avatar
United States
318 Posts
 Posted 04/27/2012  7:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add SilverEye to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Anything current that is collected will never be worth anything long term.
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basebal21's Avatar
13014 Posts
 Posted 04/27/2012  7:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add basebal21 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
My guess is that a lot of the coins could end up with significant values but I would agree I dont think nickles or pennies will. Theres just so many of them minted and people really dont use them. They save them in a giant jar and either collect what they want then and there or take it to coinstar and the process repeats. They just dont circulate like they used to so they never really have to be removed from the population.

At the same time though a lot can happen in the world. We arent exactly sitting in a great financial situation and a lot of coins and collections could end up being used to pay bills ect.

I would say the only thing thats really changed between now and back then is the ability to preserve coins. Where as in the past all old coins for the most part will fetch some sort of premium, in the future I believe only the perfect 70 coins for the majority of coins will fetch a premium since everything minted now is basically a 68 or higher
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Conder101's Avatar
United States
17884 Posts
 Posted 04/27/2012  10:47 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Conder101 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I don't think that is a comparable example, because quite a few 1911 nickels were either worn out or lost/destroyed. And most were never saved, since there weren't many collectors back then.

Actually those are exactly the thing that DO make it a valid comparison. Two coins with very similar mintages but with one there were few collaectors the coin was not considered to be any thing special and so most of them were allowed to wear, be lost and/or destroyed. AS a result the few remaining high end coins that still survive are valuable. The other has been hoarded away and a large percentage of the original mintage is most likely going to survive in high grade or even MS. So in 100 years will it show the same kind of value growth? Probably not and quite possibly not even close.
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cladking's Avatar
United States
2270 Posts
 Posted 04/28/2012  10:48 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cladking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Humans are wired to see what they expect. Everytime we open our eyes are beliefs are confirmed by observation. Our "confused" language has repercussions in thought and reinforces an inability to see what we don't expect. Once we adopt a belief it takes an act of heaven and earth to change it. We see vast quantities of '79-D cents so naturally assume there are vast quantities of '79-D quarters. We know large numbers of mint sets were made and assume these are still around because no one would buy them with the intention of spending them.

The fact is that the only reason that moderns have low price tags generally is that there is virtually no demand at all. This can be very easily proven by simply investigating the price of a BU 1972-D quarter with type "b" reverse. The fact is that despite there being no supply (probably) there's no demand. Try buying one in any grade and you'll be bidding against only one or two other bidders at most. There are probably fewer than a couple hundred of these in collector hands and there is no real market at any price. A neat little coin like a 1974-D reverse of 1972 is still unreported. So the next time you see a regular 1974 quarter in gem (if you ever do) ask yourself what it would be worth if a few hundred collectors were bidding for it instead of nearly no one at all. Ask yourself what the odds are you'd see it at all if it were popular and being added to collections. The status quo of pricing will be maintained until someone actually bids against someone else because neither can find it and both want it. When the demand materializes a great number of modern coins will be found to be scarce or rare and the prices will soar. It's just that simple.

If you asked me only three years ago whether US or USSR coins had more potential I would not have hesitated to say US coins. Numerous rarities in the cu/ ni coinage of the '60's, '70's, and '80's are coming to light everyday and prices are up as much as 1500 fold. This same thing is going on allover the world where there is a growing middle class that can afford luxuries like coin collecting. People haven't saved the base metal coins made since WW II and this is just as true in the US. I still believe that US moderns have more potential than USSR coins and are just taking longer to get attention.
Time don't fly, it bounds and leaps.
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MercuryDime's Avatar
Canada
262 Posts
 Posted 04/28/2012  11:24 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MercuryDime to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
The current U.S. Nickel will continue to rise in metallurgical value, and its composition will have to be changed soon because it's been worth more dead than alive for 6 years, the other clad coins, however, likely won't command any kind of premium, and will most likely be worth 10, 25, 50, and 100 cents for the foreseeable future, and the fact that way more people collect coins nowadays.
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cladking's Avatar
United States
2270 Posts
 Posted 04/29/2012  12:03 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cladking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
The current U.S. Nickel will continue to rise in metallurgical value, and its composition will have to be changed soon because it's been worth more dead than alive for 6 years, the other clad coins, however, likely won't command any kind of premium, and will most likely be worth 10, 25, 50, and 100 cents for the foreseeable future, and the fact that way more people collect coins nowadays.


I presume you are aware that there all the clad coins already have very high prices in very high grade. Are you suggesting that this "value" isn't true numismatic value but merely caused by a few collectors seeking bragging rights. This view can be disproven as well by the facts.
Time don't fly, it bounds and leaps.
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cladking's Avatar
United States
2270 Posts
 Posted 04/29/2012  12:06 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add cladking to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
To what do you attribute the high prices of Soviet coins? These were all 25c and 50c coins just a few years ago and now they have prices up to a few hundred dollars even in circulated condition.

http://www.rustypennies.com/catalog...t_coins.html
Time don't fly, it bounds and leaps.
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MercuryDime's Avatar
Canada
262 Posts
 Posted 04/29/2012  12:18 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MercuryDime to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
I presume you are aware that there all the clad coins already have very high prices in very high grade. Are you suggesting that this "value" isn't true numismatic value but merely caused by a few collectors seeking bragging rights. This view can be disproven as well by the facts.


Forgive me to an extent, I'm new. Really high prices may be pushing it however, and if the dollar collapses, they won't be worth anything either. Also, I'm ignoring proofs and talking about roughly handled circulated coins.



Quote:
To what do you attribute the high prices of Soviet coins? These were all 25c and 50c coins just a few years ago and now they have prices up to a few hundred dollars even in circulated condition.

http://www.rustypennies.com/catalog...t_coins.html


Relics of a past age, and even still I can't believe those prices without an ebay source. I want to see what people will actually pay for them, not what rustypenny says they're worth.
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MercuryDime's Avatar
Canada
262 Posts
 Posted 04/29/2012  12:22 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add MercuryDime to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Rarities and old un-circulated coins will always be worth a decent premium over face value, clad or not.
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CaptainFwiffo's Avatar
United States
4132 Posts
 Posted 04/29/2012  12:28 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add CaptainFwiffo to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
@cladking: You seem to have as good an understanding of moderns as anybody on the forum. What would be your Top 10 unappreciated rarities in clad-era US coinage?
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