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Whither The 1922-Pl? Like Pluto?

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jpsned's Avatar
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 Posted 05/20/2012  6:26 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add jpsned to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
I'm curious as to people's opinions about this coin. Much like the debate as to if Pluto is a planet or not, do you consider it to be a legitimate part of a full LHC collection?

I think at one time it was, mainly because back in the day, Whitman had a hole for it in their folders.

I think that many people also want to consider it to be a real coin since Philly didn't produce cents that year and this one seems to fill up that psychological void as a "mock" Philly issue (no mintmark).

On the other hand, some consider it to simply be an error coin and not worthy of further consideration. For example, if we consider this as part of a truly full collection, then you'd have to include the 1955 and 72 double dies, 60 P&D large/small dates, and similar minutiae.

Your thoughts?
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Spider5689's Avatar
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 Posted 05/20/2012  8:15 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spider5689 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I see it this way; as a collector of Lincoln cents I made the choice to include it in my collection of dates and mint marks. Others may choose not to include it since it isn't a regular issue coin. I believe the choice is strictly up to the collector, just like a collector chooses to only collect by date or one that only collects mint marks of a certain mint. No matter what people believe, the one who collects is entitled to his own collecting opinion.
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 05/21/2012  6:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
If I could change it I would, but I really dislike that the 1922-D "Plain" hole is in my Dansco. As I said in another thread, I refuse to leave it empty or fill it with something that does not belong. I will probably cheat by putting a well worn "Weak-D" in the hole.
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jdbooth's Avatar
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 Posted 05/21/2012  8:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jdbooth to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Whether you call it a variety or an error, it really is not part of the Small Cent collection unless you collect them and than it is. A collection IS whatever the collector thinks it is. It is all a matter of opinion and interpretation.

So in saying that ask yourself "Does it belong on my collection?"
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Spider5689's Avatar
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 Posted 05/21/2012  9:58 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spider5689 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Since I started collecting Ancient Roman Coins, I have noticed a lot of people tend to collect the 12 caesars, some collect late roman bronze. Most members on this forum specialize in different types of themes. With Ancient coins, there is no right or wrong way to collect coins. Everyone has their own idea of what they want their collection to include. With Lincolns I feel the same way. Not everyone wants or feels the need to collect the 1922 No D. Personally, I collect date and mint marks. I don't consider it an inclusion in the series, I own one because it compliments the series just like my 1956 Lincoln struck on a Dime Planchet. Just about everyone and myself would agree that it doesn't need to be included in a Lincoln Cent collection.
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 Posted 05/22/2012  08:45 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think this has been brought up in the past and most said it is a stupid thing to put in a collection. Nit sure but I think Whitman is responsible for making many coins part of a collection since they put them in their Albums. Most of my Albums are all Whitman and their are slots for the 22 plain, all of the 60's, all of the 70S's, all of the 82's, 55 & 72 & 95 Doubled Dies, separate slots for proofs starting in the 70area. And if you look in the latest Red Book there are more and more error coins listed so I would imagine in the near future all their Albums will also have slots for every error coin ever made. Although Dansco is sort of the Album of this forum, Whitman is still one of the most popular Publishers for coins so whatever they do is basically copied, right or wrong.
Then it is up to the individual whether they want to abide by whatever Whitman says or just leave empty slots in their Albums.
Yes, it is only an error coin but then again, so are most of the others mentioned above. I know that many are actually varieties such as the different 82's, but why make Albums for all those? Why not just one date, one mint per coin? OR just really get nutty and have slots for every error coin ever minted?
And speaking of Pluto. If Pluto is still to be considered a planet, then what do you call Hades, the one a bit farther out and it is bigger than Pluto?
Whither-The-1922-Pl?--Like-Pluto?
Edited by just carl
05/22/2012 08:49 am
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 Posted 05/22/2012  09:00 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add BadThad to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm drooling far more over your other 20's coins than that 22 plain! NICE!
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wquinn's Avatar
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 Posted 05/22/2012  11:05 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add wquinn to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think it doesn't belong in the basic Lincoln set collection, since it is an error coin. I never plan to buy one. They are just way over priced and the same thing has been done with other error coins, like the 3 legged Buffalo nickel.
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 05/22/2012  2:33 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Pluto is still to be considered a planet, then what do you call Hades, the one a bit farther out and it is bigger than Pluto?
You mean Eris, the dwarf planet whose discovery caused Pluto's ultimate demotion.
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Sap's Avatar
Australia
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 Posted 05/22/2012  8:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Sap to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I've never thought Pluto should have been classified as a planet; it's always been merely a really, really big comet to my mind.

And since the 1922-plain is "merely" a worn/filled die, then it isn't really part of a date-mintmark set, any more than a die crack belongs there.

Nor do I feel a "psychological gap" that's more significant than any other gaps. There were no 1 cent coins minted in Philadelphia in 1922. There weren't any made in San Francisco that year, either, nor any Denver-mintmarked coins the following year. They're all real, actual gaps in the series that cannot be filled because they don't exist. A responsible album manufacturer wouldn't continue to include spaces for any of these error/variety coins in a date-mintmark set album.
Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise, you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. - C. S. Lewis
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ratio411's Avatar
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 Posted 05/22/2012  9:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ratio411 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't think that any error coin, die variety, or substandard strike (such as the plain), should be included in any album. I don't appreciate that the hole is in my Dansco, but what can you do...

I would draw the line at only varities that are beyond just die prep, like the VDBs and small dates, as well as the planchet changes (copper to zinc or silver to clad).
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ratio411's Avatar
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 Posted 05/22/2012  9:14 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ratio411 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
You know what cheezes me off about the albums:
Inconsistency.

The JFK album has holes for the SMS and business strikes, but doesn't have the holes for the 2005-2010 satins.
Then NONE of the other modern books have holes for the SMS coins, or the satins.

Make up your mind!
Put the SMS and satins in EVERY modern album, or leave them out of every modern album.
Same with the 79,80,81 proof mint mark varieties. Put ALL of them, or leave them out. Don't put in 1 or 2 when that series had 3, for example.
The nickels or the JFKs don't have holes for the satin proofs... Those SHOULD be there before some of the others.

If you go with an album, you are at the maker's mercy on what you call complete.
Otherwise you have to have some in the album and some out, or you have to buy extra pages and keep them out of order, which is a turn off as well.
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jdbooth's Avatar
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 Posted 05/23/2012  10:24 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jdbooth to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Well said brother Ratio! Can I get an AMEN?!
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 Posted 05/23/2012  11:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add just carl to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
You mean Eris, the dwarf planet whose discovery caused Pluto's ultimate demotion.

OOppps. True. Hades was the name of Pluto once. And Eris actually comes within the orbit of Pluto at times.
As to the 22 plain. All of those typs of error coins should be left out of Albums. Not sure about some of the coins that are actually highly improbable though. In an old Whitman I have a slot for the 1913 Liberty Head Nickel. Also, in an Album a slot for the 1894S Liberty Head Dime.
With the Mercury dime, is a 42/41 and 42D/41 really a normal coin? Nor really an error but what do you call those over dates? Just as the 22 Plain is required to fill holes, many Albums require those but should they?
Whither-The-1922-Pl?--Like-Pluto?
This is in my Album but should it be?
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jbuck's Avatar
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 Posted 05/23/2012  3:20 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add jbuck to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think that (popular) Errors and Varieties are included because enough people demanded that they be included. Not saying it was the right call for the long term, but it probably made sense (and a significant number of people happy) at the time.
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ljenkins990's Avatar
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406 Posts
 Posted 05/23/2012  5:34 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add ljenkins990 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I don't like having a hole for the 22-plain in my Dansco either, but I've come to terms with it. Who knows, maybe I'll acquire one some day, but it won't be anytime soon unless I find one in pocket change .

Every so often I play with the idea of taking a label maker and relabeling my Dansco pages to get rid of irritating inconsistencies like that. Never have gone through with it, though.

Poor little Pluto. I hated to see it get demoted but it really was inevitable after the discovery of Eris and all those other Trans-Neptunian objects out there. There is precedent, though - Ceres was once considered to be a planet also.
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